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    Originally posted by ephileth View Post
    No chance of another SA lock to replace Grobler indeed, we have already signed Beirne to replace him.
    Beirne and Holland are both converted back row players, Beirne has played at BR a good bit this season for Scarlets( played 8 v Toulon). Kleyn is injury prone. No way we can compete at the top level in Europe with that list, even this season we had to call in Devin Toners cousin as a medical joker. You could see our 2nd row was tired v Leinster.

    We need another big lump, either Grobler or a recruit. Wychelry looks very talented but is still a year/2 away. DOS looks average and we are just not producing any good homegrown 2nd row players at the moment. We can have all the back 3 players in the world but we need to be able to bully teams with a strong pack.
    Last edited by Tobyglen; 30th-December-2017, 17:25.

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      Grobler is only here for a year isn’t he?


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        Originally posted by the plastic paddy View Post
        Grobler is only here for a year isn’t he?


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        Yep 1 year, Flannery was talking very positively about him on podcast recently.

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          Originally posted by Tobyglen View Post
          Yep 1 year, Flannery was talking very positively about him on podcast recently.
          I saw him in the pre season game where he got injured. He looked to have very good hands but I would suggest that he is more of a rangy 5.5/6 than a proper baby muncher. Big Jean is a proper piano shifter tight head lock whose main focus is hitting things. I would say O’Shea is more of a Kleyn type. Fineen more of a 5.5/6.


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            Ring Rassie.


            Don't bother looking for world class names, just get more DuToits Kleyns Tautes and Cloetes, their system is overflowing with lads who can't get their game because they're perceived too small or too slow for superrrrhagby

            Give some white fringe 10/12 a whirl for a year and see what happens. A lad who kicks his goals and finds touch consistently is the bar.

            Next seasons pack is chocabloc either with young guns or with leaders
            I am the million man.

            Comment


              Originally posted by the plastic paddy View Post
              I saw him in the pre season game where he got injured. He looked to have very good hands but I would suggest that he is more of a rangy 5.5/6 than a proper baby muncher. Big Jean is a proper piano shifter tight head lock whose main focus is hitting things. I would say O’Shea is more of a Kleyn type. Fineen more of a 5.5/6.


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              Fla was saying that, his skills are way above normal 2nd row. He is 6.6 and 120kg all the same. Big Unit.

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                I dont think we are doing terribly bad in any position, there is depth this season in places we didn't last year, injury aside the squad shapes up nicely and the loss of Zebo is offset by the season Wooten and conway are having, and ROM, Earls coming back to play.

                I think what we are missing is a Jim Williams even a De Villiers, or a Cullen maybe. A type of player who has seen and done it all, has plenty of miles on the clock, and maybe even their best rugby behind them, but experience that is invaluable, international caps coming out his ears and rugby brains to burn.

                Sure POM and Stander are great leaders and players, but they dont have that few percent we are missing, maybe its going to have to wait until after the RWC to sign such a player but I would love to see us snap up a quality player who retires from International duty after the next WC, if Toulon don't get there first.

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                  Originally posted by Cowboy View Post
                  Ring Rassie.


                  Don't bother looking for world class names, just get more DuToits Kleyns Tautes and Cloetes, their system is overflowing with lads who can't get their game because they're perceived too small or too slow for superrrrhagby

                  Give some white fringe 10/12 a whirl for a year and see what happens. A lad who kicks his goals and finds touch consistently is the bar.

                  Next seasons pack is chocabloc either with young guns or with leaders

                  No, no and thrice no.

                  I've been waiting for a fly half to grow into the role for half a decade now. There's no room left on the pot with the number of lads who still haven't managed to piss.

                  England are still snubbing Cipriani.....we don't have a fly half within an asses roar of him.
                  "We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow

                  "Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy


                  "I think that progress has been made by two flames that have always been burning in the human heart. The flame of anger against injustice and the flame of hope that you can build a better world" - Tony Benn

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                    Originally posted by Balla Boy View Post
                    No, no and thrice no.

                    I've been waiting for a fly half to grow into the role for half a decade now. There's no room left on the pot with the number of lads who still haven't managed to piss.

                    England are still snubbing Cipriani.....we don't have a fly half within an asses roar of him.
                    You don't think Kleyn and Cloete are at the level required?

                    There's a world of cheap players out there
                    I am the million man.

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                      Originally posted by Cowboy View Post
                      You don't think Kleyn and Cloete are at the level required?

                      There's a world of cheap players out there
                      Not Fly Halves. The Saffers breed front five and back row like fruit flys. They aren't replete with half backs, and never have been. They barely have a test quality stand off available to them.
                      "We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow

                      "Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy


                      "I think that progress has been made by two flames that have always been burning in the human heart. The flame of anger against injustice and the flame of hope that you can build a better world" - Tony Benn

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Balla Boy View Post
                        Not Fly Halves. The Saffers breed front five and back row like fruit flys. They aren't replete with half backs, and never have been. They barely have a test quality stand off available to them.
                        I'd think it's worth a punt


                        We were touting Goosen like
                        I am the million man.

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                          "Hello? Is that Canterbury Crusaders? Can I speak to Ronan O'Gara please?"
                          Munster – Champions of Europe 2006, 2008, 2020.

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                            Originally posted by Cowboy View Post
                            I'd think it's worth a punt


                            We were touting Goosen like

                            You're more patient than me right now. We've been punting on fly halves for a while.

                            Consider - in the whole pro era, we've had one fly half that could be relied on to deliver consistently at European level. One. A thousand point test international.


                            I've done the breakdown of Euro finalists here before, but it's worth bearing winners in mind:


                            2017 - Farrell
                            2016 - Farrell
                            2015 - Giteau
                            2014 - Wilkinson
                            2013 - Wilkinson
                            2012 - Sexton
                            2011 - Sexton
                            2010 - Skrela
                            2009 - Sexton
                            2008 - O'Gara
                            2007 - King
                            2006 - O'Gara
                            2005 - Michalak
                            2004 - King
                            2003 - Delaigue
                            2002 - Healey
                            2001 - Goode
                            2000 - Grayson
                            1999 - Humphreys
                            1998 - Catt
                            1997 - Penaud
                            1996 - Castaignade


                            That means that with the bizarre exception of Healey for Tigers, Alex King is the worst fly half to ever win a European Final.


                            That's where the benchmark sits. If we want to compete at that level, we have to have a test quality fly half.
                            "We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow

                            "Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy


                            "I think that progress has been made by two flames that have always been burning in the human heart. The flame of anger against injustice and the flame of hope that you can build a better world" - Tony Benn

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by Balla Boy View Post
                              You're more patient than me right now. We've been punting on fly halves for a while.

                              Consider - in the whole pro era, we've had one fly half that could be relied on to deliver consistently at European level. One. A thousand point test international.


                              I've done the breakdown of Euro finalists here before, but it's worth bearing winners in mind:


                              2017 - Farrell
                              2016 - Farrell
                              2015 - Giteau
                              2014 - Wilkinson
                              2013 - Wilkinson
                              2012 - Sexton
                              2011 - Sexton
                              2010 - Skrela
                              2009 - Sexton
                              2008 - O'Gara
                              2007 - King
                              2006 - O'Gara
                              2005 - Michalak
                              2004 - King
                              2003 - Delaigue
                              2002 - Healey
                              2001 - Goode
                              2000 - Grayson
                              1999 - Humphreys
                              1998 - Catt
                              1997 - Penaud
                              1996 - Castaignade


                              That means that with the bizarre exception of Healey for Tigers, Alex King is the worst fly half to ever win a European Final.


                              That's where the benchmark sits. If we want to compete at that level, we have to have a test quality fly half.
                              Not to piss on your chips, we haven't a snowballs of affording a 600k 10.
                              We could have three 200k players for that like


                              Cipriani ain't gonna win a 6N or RCC anytime soon either because wasps haven't any true grit


                              We DO have true grit, we just need a **** who can kick his goals and get us out of our own 22
                              I am the million man.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Cowboy View Post
                                Not to piss on your chips, we haven't a snowballs of affording a 600k 10.
                                We could have three 200k players for that like


                                Cipriani ain't gonna win a 6N or RCC anytime soon either because wasps haven't any true grit


                                We DO have true grit, we just need a **** who can kick his goals and get us out of our own 22
                                No fly half with a skill set at that level has won anything for a good long while.

                                In salary terms, POM + Stander + Zebo has got to equal a proven player.
                                "We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow

                                "Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy


                                "I think that progress has been made by two flames that have always been burning in the human heart. The flame of anger against injustice and the flame of hope that you can build a better world" - Tony Benn

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