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Keatley v JJ

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    Keatley v JJ

    Who should be our starting 10 this season?

    For me it's JJ. I think while Keatley's done well, he had a difficult job taking over from ROG when many (including myself) thought we'd be fcked when he retired.
    We know what he'll give us and it's grand and fine, he's a solid player, but JJ can offer that little bit extra. Keatley is a good player but lacks that creativity and decision making that JJ has.
    Since ROG left the main focus has been taken off the out half, a combination of the fact that Keatley isn't much of a play maker and Murray taking on extra responsibilities.

    JJ has, in the opportunities he's been given, shown us how creative he is, what an intelligent player he is and the potential player he could be.
    I think if we don't start him more this year he may look for a new club next season, and that would be a disaster if we let him go.
    You can only be young with potential for so long.

    There is always the option of having them both on the pitch, with JJ at 10 and Keatley at 12.
    Which I think is probably our best option.
    Thoughts?
    42
    JJ
    57.14%
    24
    Keatley
    4.76%
    2
    Both
    38.10%
    16
    Last edited by Stringer9; 20th-September-2014, 18:57.
    The Maul is Back!! LONG LIVE THE MAUL!!

    Stringer is bigger even than his own immense shadow. Pound for pound, he is the best tackler in the world. If you put him into bag of cats he\'d come out without a scratch. He was hit very late for Murphy\'s try. And when he got up, as we knew he would, the crowd cried his name as if he had just fixed the economy.Billy Keane-After Munster\'s famous loss to the AB\'s.

    The Bull-Truly irreplaceable, a mountain of a man. 100 caps!!

    #2
    When JJ can play like he can for a successive no of games, and for the entirety of the games he will be our first choice 10.


    Alot of posters refer to the IRB nomination over and over from the year he played well at the U20 RWC . . . . .ye they never seem to take account of the fact that while he had a very very good tournament . . . .the direct reason for his nomination . . . he was only starting at 10 as Jackson was retained at home at his and his provinces wish. JJ hadn't done enough until then to put him ahead of Jackson. . . .in other words he hadn't been producing performances like that we saw at the U20 RWC consistently. . .

    And he came back after that competition and put in some average performances in the AIL.

    There is no doubting the guy has talent, skill and ability . . . he was very good last night for me . . .first game back and all . . .but a bit of inconsistency, maybe a lack of 80min performances and of course a niggly injury are the reason he's not starting 10 imo.
    Last edited by Corcíoch; 20th-September-2014, 19:16.

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by Corcíoch View Post
      When JJ can play like he can for a successive no of games, and for the entirety of the games he will be our first choice 10.


      Alot of posters refer to the IRB nomination over and over from the year he played well at the U20 RWC . . . . .ye they never seem to take account of the fact that while he had a very very good tournament . . . .the direct reason for his nomination . . . he was only starting at 10 as Jackson was retained at home at his and his provinces wish. JJ hadn't done enough until then to put him ahead of Jackson. . . .in other words he hadn't been producing performances like that we saw at the U20 RWC consistently. . .

      And he came back after that competition and put in some average performances in the AIL.

      There is no doubting the guy has talent, skill and ability . . . he was very good last night for me . . .first game back and all . . .but a bit of inconsistency, maybe a lack of 80 performances and of course a niggly injury are the reason he's not starting 10 imo.
      He's never really given a chance to play back to back full games. How can you make have consistent form when you're not consistently playing. No amount of training and practice can replace game time on the pitch.
      The Maul is Back!! LONG LIVE THE MAUL!!

      Stringer is bigger even than his own immense shadow. Pound for pound, he is the best tackler in the world. If you put him into bag of cats he\'d come out without a scratch. He was hit very late for Murphy\'s try. And when he got up, as we knew he would, the crowd cried his name as if he had just fixed the economy.Billy Keane-After Munster\'s famous loss to the AB\'s.

      The Bull-Truly irreplaceable, a mountain of a man. 100 caps!!

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by Stringer9 View Post
        He's never really given a chance to play back to back full games. How can you make have consistent form when you're not consistently playing. No amount of training and practice can replace game time on the pitch.
        You don't get a place on the Munster team to allow you develop . . . .you get your game when you are the best option for the shirt . . . .squad rotation aside.

        One wonders was there much truth to the talk about issues last year or the year before too??


        Anyway, thats neither here nor there. Ill state my opinion that when he produces what we all know he is capable of . .and does it consistently for 80 mins he will take over the 10 jersey. When he is better than Keatley who won a few MOM titles in the last 2 seasons iirc.

        Leave out the brain farts like last years H Cup one . .

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Corcíoch View Post
          When JJ can play like he can for a successive no of games, and for the entirety of the games he will be our first choice 10.


          Alot of posters refer to the IRB nomination over and over from the year he played well at the U20 RWC . . . . .ye they never seem to take account of the fact that while he had a very very good tournament . . . .the direct reason for his nomination . . . he was only starting at 10 as Jackson was retained at home at his and his provinces wish. JJ hadn't done enough until then to put him ahead of Jackson. . . .in other words he hadn't been producing performances like that we saw at the U20 RWC consistently. . .

          And he came back after that competition and put in some average performances in the AIL.

          There is no doubting the guy has talent, skill and ability . . . he was very good last night for me . . .first game back and all . . .but a bit of inconsistency, maybe a lack of 80min performances and of course a niggly injury are the reason he's not starting 10 imo.
          JJ wasn't sitting on the bench - he was starting at 12. All that selection suggests is that JJ is a better 12 than Jackson (who needed to be fastrated at 10 anyway for Ulster).

          Jackson's kicking was poor in the 6Ns that year, yet he was taking the kicks with JJ there - that suggests to me they were trying to fastrack him. Jackson usually went off and JJ was moved to 10 (luckily in time to nail that very difficult kick to win away in France for the first time).

          Also worth noting - Luke McGrath was the preferred scrumhalf with Jackson. Kieran Marmion sat on the bench until South Africa world cup where he was paired with JJ.

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Stringer9 View Post
            He's never really given a chance to play back to back full games. How can you make have consistent form when you're not consistently playing. No amount of training and practice can replace game time on the pitch.
            The reason is probably they were trying to manage his (and Keatley's) groin problems. Rest is the first option for their injury. It was crazy that both of those had to go on the Emerging Ireland trip. They should have been left at home and got Ian Humphreys (or someone like that) to go.

            Comment


              #7
              I liked JJ from the first time I saw him in MP against the Scarlets two seasons ago. He came on late and was given a Pen in the last minute to get the bonus point.

              The kick was into the wind and (horizontal) rain from about 25 yards and he nailed it.

              Balls of Steel.

              Like ROG.

              I looked it up on the Pro12 Site to identify the opponents. The attendance that night, in the pissings of rain, was 6219, the highest Pro12 attendance of that round.

              Comment


                #8
                J.Jaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy yyyyyyyyyyyyyy!!! Moves like a panther, passes like George Clooney at a supermodels convention, kicks like, weeeeel.....Unbelievable after months without a match. Of course as a Kerryman I am biased, but all things being equal, the defining decision between JJ and Keats is that JJ is a product of both the club youth and schools game here in our province - one of our own.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Corcíoch View Post
                  You don't get a place on the Munster team to allow you develop . . . .you get your game when you are the best option for the shirt . . . .squad rotation aside.

                  One wonders was there much truth to the talk about issues last year or the year before too??


                  Anyway, thats neither here nor there. Ill state my opinion that when he produces what we all know he is capable of . .and does it consistently for 80 mins he will take over the 10 jersey. When he is better than Keatley who won a few MOM titles in the last 2 seasons iirc.

                  Leave out the brain farts like last years H Cup one . .
                  Had the balls to try though, and got away with the same thing in the U20 RWC where he caught it and made 50 meters upfield from being under pressure near own line.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Does JJ actually suit Foley's game plan? We really lacked a General against Eburg. We didn't have one on the pitch that night. It's not just sniping runs that defeat defenses. Let's hope that one of the two really step up

                    Comment


                      #11
                      JJ for me.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        JJ for me but can too but can Keately play at 12 or perhaps at 15?
                        If your religion is worth killing for, please start with yourself.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          You won't win European cups with Keatley at 10. If that's our ambition then we need something different. If our ambition is top 4 in the Pro 12, then Keatley is the man for that job.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Corcíoch View Post
                            You don't get a place on the Munster team to allow you develop . . . .you get your game when you are the best option for the shirt . . . .squad rotation aside.

                            One wonders was there much truth to the talk about issues last year or the year before too??


                            Anyway, thats neither here nor there. Ill state my opinion that when he produces what we all know he is capable of . .and does it consistently for 80 mins he will take over the 10 jersey. When he is better than Keatley who won a few MOM titles in the last 2 seasons iirc.

                            Leave out the brain farts like last years H Cup one . .
                            Well that's a falacy. Out of necessity many of our golden generation, like ROG, were thrown into the side a little early and it took them a couple of full seasons to develop to the level required. But it was that early experience that was the making of them.

                            JJ may not have been consistently brilliant in every game but he has shown moments of brilliance and, critically, they've often come in big games.

                            Keatley is decent but he's not all that consistent either, nor is he ever really brilliant. He's had plenty of poor games and, at his age, is unlikely to get much better. He's not going to win us a European cup, that's as plain as day. I do like the look of him as a potential 12, for which he has the attributes. He just doesn't have the playmaking ability to win us the big games as a 10.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Keatley is a good ten generally, But JJ seems to be able to produce something out of nothing, elusive lines etc, We need JJ at ten.

                              Comment

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