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    Originally posted by lawrence View Post
    Isn’t the appeal all but a formality, that they can only appeal procedural aspects or something, not the actually fine? Essentially they are only buying time?
    Probably/hopefully - but why would they change their plans for his season before they have to?

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      Originally posted by jagawayagain View Post

      Probably/hopefully - but why would they change their plans for his season before they have to?
      But the do have to change their plans. McCall already said that they treating the season like the points deduction is set in stone. Being in the Premiership next season is more important to them than being in Europe. It's no good to them if the go all out in Europe but don't make up enough points in the league and then get hit with the deduction.

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        Originally posted by Wallyman View Post

        But the do have to change their plans. McCall already said that they treating the season like the points deduction is set in stone. Being in the Premiership next season is more important to them than being in Europe. It's no good to them if the go all out in Europe but don't make up enough points in the league and then get hit with the deduction.
        Hard to know what to make of what McCall says, or indeed anyone at saracens. The selection this week will give us a clearer indication, an away win this weekend would be quite a prize, you’d imagine almost any side they put out the week after is enough to beat Ospreys at home, theres then they have Bath, who are poor so far, before back to back against us, and three tough fixtures. If they are bothered about relegation, beating the top sides is less helpful than beating the lower ones. Depending on when they decide to play their RWC players, I think they can easily stay competitive in Europe, for the first few rounds, without damaging their league prospects.

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          Saracens named their Euro squad before the finding so regardless of what team they put out they will still be quality players

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            Originally posted by Lonstonitis View Post
            Saracens named their Euro squad before the finding so regardless of what team they put out they will still be quality players
            There's no doubt it's a quality squad. But if they play without the Vunipolas, Itoje, Farrell, George, etc then that brings them down a level.

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              I'm still not clear on when Sarries will have to take remedial action on their squad. I know there's no salary cap for the squad they've named for Europe, but that same squad is still surely over the salary cap for the Premiership?
              "We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow

              "Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy


              "I think that progress has been made by two flames that have always been burning in the human heart. The flame of anger against injustice and the flame of hope that you can build a better world" - Tony Benn

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                Originally posted by Balla Boy View Post
                I'm still not clear on when Sarries will have to take remedial action on their squad. I know there's no salary cap for the squad they've named for Europe, but that same squad is still surely over the salary cap for the Premiership?

                Not necessarily.

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                  Originally posted by Lonstonitis View Post
                  Saracens named their Euro squad before the finding so regardless of what team they put out they will still be quality players
                  I think they're obliged under EPCR regulations to enter their strongest possible squad of 41 for the competition but are then free to pick whatever 23 they want from that selection, with the usual proviso around naming appropriate front-row players. Montpellier were fined for leaving out some of their top names from their Challenge Cup squad a few years back

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                    Racing lock Nakarawa a doubt to face Munster after returning from World Cup two weeks late https://the42.ie/4889322

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                      Originally posted by Wallyman View Post

                      But the do have to change their plans. McCall already said that they treating the season like the points deduction is set in stone. Being in the Premiership next season is more important to them than being in Europe. It's no good to them if the go all out in Europe but don't make up enough points in the league and then get hit with the deduction.
                      TBH something really strange needs to happen if they would end in last place in the premiership. -35 points is not enough for that.

                      There's however no hope that they will qualify for Europe so winning the championship is their only hope.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Chrizzzie View Post

                        TBH something really strange needs to happen if they would end in last place in the premiership. -35 points is not enough for that.

                        There's however no hope that they will qualify for Europe so winning the championship is their only hope.
                        That presumes that they will want to focus on Europe next year. Where will their focus lie, as the squad (more than likely) gets thinned out from its current level?

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Chrizzzie View Post

                          TBH something really strange needs to happen if they would end in last place in the premiership. -35 points is not enough for that.

                          There's however no hope that they will qualify for Europe so winning the championship is their only hope.
                          Given they’d need to make 6th place (7th?) to be in the HCup next year I think there is some chance of of them making it. They have the capacity to 5-0 anyone with their current squad- and no lower team has much prospect of doing so. It would be a tall ask, but isn’t impossible. For example London Irish, having a decent start, but when the international players come back to all the other sides can they keep that up? They might decide no to fight on two fronts - but too soon to decide which one, and I wonder how the 6N will affect them. Nice as it would be to seem them struggle- I think it’s far too soon to write them off. However, lose in France on Sunday, and to us in Limerick- and they might well decide differently. The play very effective rugby, have boatloads of very good/excellent players- if anyone could pull it out of the fire they can.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by jagawayagain View Post

                            Given they’d need to make 6th place (7th?) to be in the HCup next year I think there is some chance of of them making it. They have the capacity to 5-0 anyone with their current squad- and no lower team has much prospect of doing so. It would be a tall ask, but isn’t impossible. For example London Irish, having a decent start, but when the international players come back to all the other sides can they keep that up? They might decide no to fight on two fronts - but too soon to decide which one, and I wonder how the 6N will affect them. Nice as it would be to seem them struggle- I think it’s far too soon to write them off. However, lose in France on Sunday, and to us in Limerick- and they might well decide differently. The play very effective rugby, have boatloads of very good/excellent players- if anyone could pull it out of the fire they can.
                            If they want to secure the play-off spot for European rugby they need to get 12 points more than last year. That is quite a big ask.

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                              It is widely suggested that winning the CC is Sarries' only chance of playing in it next season but, in the event they end up winning the CC while finishing bottom of the Premiership, what happens then? I do not believe this has ever happened but I can hardly imagine how a team relegated to the Championship could play in the Champions Cup, even being reigning champions.
                              Last edited by ephileth; 13th-November-2019, 18:27.
                              Good things happen to those who wait, though mostly much too late.

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                                Lads, England world cup players can play a max of 30 games this season. Billy V already has 10 played and theres 5 more games in the 6N, meaning Saracens have him for 15 games. If he plays in every Euro game until the final, then he's only available for 6 Premiership games. The other Saracens players aren't far behind him. They'll have no choice but to rest their internationals in Europe if they want them available for the league.

                                As I said previously being in the Premiership next season is more important to them than being in the CC.
                                Last edited by Wallyman; 13th-November-2019, 20:31.

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