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Pro 14 games in sth africa

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    They're a good team with a massive pack who are acclimatised to the altitude, it's no coincidence they hockeyed Glasgow and Ulster also. Fair play to them, it's good news for the league also. Edit, delighted to see Pienaar settled in a good team, he's one of the great players.
    When things go wrong, blame McGahan

    Comment


      Je**s that was worrying, a decent Munster team destroyed, I haven seen a Munster pack humiliated like that since.........never!
      We were flinging the ball around like Rob Penney was back in town, entertaining but playing into their hands, literally at times.
      Our strength in depth was really exposed tonight.
      That was a seriously good Munster pack and I dont think its going to get hugely better when the Internationals return.
      Cheetahs look like serious contenders this year.
      Pienaar is a class act.
      The referee was a gowl, but no worse than Munster.
      'twas wicked yousir!

      Comment


        Originally posted by Surveyor View Post
        That was a seriously good Munster pack and I dont think its going to get hugely better when the Internationals return.
        You don't think killer, Scannell, Ryan, beirne, kleyn, POM and Stander would improve the pack? Ok...
        When things go wrong, blame McGahan

        Comment


          Originally posted by untilyouhearthatbell View Post
          To be honest I don’t see any new things.

          One up carriers on their own.
          Backs just passing out the line, haven’t seen one move.
          Box kick after box kick.
          Scrum destroyed.
          Didnt contest an opposition lineout and then mauled back

          Same stuff weve seen the last few seasons. Might get an away semi final again but the lack of creativity I can’t get over.

          When we tired, and they were constantly off side we reverted to that old style, but Goggins try, for example,
          was very nicely constructed.
          Last edited by jagawayagain; 11th-October-2019, 19:58.

          Comment


            I'll have a look at it later. Watch the first 15 min and the players looked to be struggling even then! The commentators mentioned it too.


            Don't underestimate the altitude. It's a huge advantage and results over the decades show that. They've also been playing for months and are at home while it's early season for Munster.


            3rd game into a long season with a new style of play being introduced. They won't master a new style of play after a month of action.

            Comment


              We were well beaten by a far more settled side, at altitude, which killed us. We were almost blown away at the start, but cling on tightened our discipline and were justifiably close at half time. Second half we didn’t manage to slow it as much as we did in the first, and they opened up, and utterly dominated. No sour grapes, but the referring and TMO was dire, poor referring of off side, torpedoes at most attacking rucks, and an incredible amount of blocking going on, and left unpenalised. Scrum has a lot of work to do to be able to cope in these conditions- Rownteee has plenty to do there. I though Jacko and Fineen did well, TB and JJ solid, Haley had another decent game- Daly faded out of it completely, after a promising start, thought Nash looked lively in an exhausted side at the end.

              I think Scannell will struggle to keep his place when the internationals come back- he has less attackingnpotential than other options. Am glad we rotated as much as we did- I don’t think last weeks side would have done any better. Disappointing to lose so comprehensively, but altitude and an early season unsettled side against a solid settles home side here was always going to be a tall order. Would be too carried away by the negatives.

              Comment


                Well played cheetahs
                Watched Leinster V Edin.
                We appear to be way off the Pace again. No silverware again this year,
                Think we need need a smaller high quality player pool, accepting that injuries will ruin many seasons but ‘illegal ‘ medical jokers could make us Competitive.
                Otherwise we are Leinster B plus our academy players. Previously this could have been competitive, but the playoff format means this strategy is doomed to failure.

                Comment


                  Originally posted by reded View Post
                  Well played cheetahs
                  Watched Leinster V Edin.
                  We appear to be way off the Pace again. No silverware again this year,
                  Think we need need a smaller high quality player pool, accepting that injuries will ruin many seasons but ‘illegal ‘ medical jokers could make us Competitive.
                  Otherwise we are Leinster B plus our academy players. Previously this could have been competitive, but the playoff format means this strategy is doomed to failure.
                  Let’s not rush to judgement. Leinster has a far more serious preseason, and Edinburgh at home are a very different matter to cheetahs at altitude.

                  Comment


                    Cheetahs only won the Currie cup . They are a serious outfit. We are a B team at the mo. Players getting game time.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by B.A. View Post

                      You don't think killer, Scannell, Ryan, beirne, kleyn, POM and Stander would improve the pack? Ok...
                      The point I was making is that on paper it was already a good Munster pack, Cronin, Marshall and Archer will still be the replacement front row and some may start. Botha, Jacko and Tommy will be vying for a starting place, may keep some of the internationals out of the team, and will be in the replacements at least. The return of the Internationals should improve the pack but not to the extent that the gulf we saw today will be bridged IMO. What really worries me though is that a pack that looked to me to be excellent in the context of our international absentees, and to be a reflection of some serious strength in depth, turned out to be anything but. I suspect that the altitude played a part in our second half collapse, and a cold wet and windy TP may similarly help us. It is of course also possible that the Cheetahs are just a lot better than us, which is no consolation at all.
                      'twas wicked yousir!

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by reded View Post
                        Well played cheetahs
                        Watched Leinster V Edin.
                        We appear to be way off the Pace again. No silverware again this year,
                        Think we need need a smaller high quality player pool, accepting that injuries will ruin many seasons but ‘illegal ‘ medical jokers could make us Competitive.
                        Otherwise we are Leinster B plus our academy players. Previously this could have been competitive, but the playoff format means this strategy is doomed to failure.
                        Bloody hell....away against a good team at altitude who were missing one player whist we were missing a shed load.

                        Comment


                          The one thing Munster have to do is to avoid having to go to Bloemfontein in the Playoffs on a week's notice.

                          (Unless, of course, the alternative is to go nowhere in the playoffs)

                          Comment


                            Cheetahs have beaten a lot of the top sides at home in the last two years. We beat them twice barely over there I believe. They are a good team no doubt but their away form will be their undoing and as the season wears on they will fade away.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by Surveyor View Post

                              The point I was making is that on paper it was already a good Munster pack, Cronin, Marshall and Archer will still be the replacement front row and some may start. Botha, Jacko and Tommy will be vying for a starting place, may keep some of the internationals out of the team, and will be in the replacements at least. The return of the Internationals should improve the pack but not to the extent that the gulf we saw today will be bridged IMO. What really worries me though is that a pack that looked to me to be excellent in the context of our international absentees, and to be a reflection of some serious strength in depth, turned out to be anything but. I suspect that the altitude played a part in our second half collapse, and a cold wet and windy TP may similarly help us. It is of course also possible that the Cheetahs are just a lot better than us, which is no consolation at all.
                              It was a good Munster pack, but when you go up to that altitude against players who normally play there, they have a huge advantage. Think back to the tour in 2016, Second test, at altitude, Ireland were bossing the Boks around the field the first half...the second half rolls around, Boks get back into it about, around 50-55 minutes, Coetzee throws on a bunch of replacements, mostly guys who play at altitude, and the tide shifts greatly. That's what happened tonight. They didn't just get worked over in the second half b/c they are worse than the Cheetahs, those guys were playing in normal air for them, and Munster's guys were sucking wind. Anyone who wants to get a win down there is going to have to make hay during the first 45-55 minutes of the game b/c after that they will start to get very tired very quickly.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Surveyor View Post

                                The point I was making is that on paper it was already a good Munster pack, Cronin, Marshall and Archer will still be the replacement front row and some may start. Botha, Jacko and Tommy will be vying for a starting place, may keep some of the internationals out of the team, and will be in the replacements at least. The return of the Internationals should improve the pack but not to the extent that the gulf we saw today will be bridged IMO. What really worries me though is that a pack that looked to me to be excellent in the context of our international absentees, and to be a reflection of some serious strength in depth, turned out to be anything but. I suspect that the altitude played a part in our second half collapse, and a cold wet and windy TP may similarly help us. It is of course also possible that the Cheetahs are just a lot better than us, which is no consolation at all.
                                We were certainly shown to be wanting- I too was very positive about the pack we put on the pitch, and I’d be happy to see the same lads start the next game. Those conditions were very tough- the effort required was very evident on their faces too, but they were far better, used to playing together, at home and at altitude. I don’t think how we played is a real index of where we will be in a few weeks, but there are lessons to be learned.. At one point Archer went backwards in the scrum, both feet in the air- and .. but Fineen is settling into second row nicely, Jacko has added real strength and devil to his game, and our line outs worked well more or or less throughout. When what is basically a whole pack comes back from the World Cup, it will also be a huge boost, but I hope Fineen, Jacko and others will continue to be given the opportunities they are now grasping.

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