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Munster Squad 2019-2020

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    #16
    Originally posted by brightspark View Post
    That’s pretty damming for limerick underage/schools rugby. I’m heavily involved in a limerick club and north munster affairs and i can tell you it will only get worse if the relevant heads in youth/schools are not knocked together soon.
    I used to know- but have been out of it for too long- but reading these comments and those in other fora, there seems to be a mixture of denial and wishful thinking. Munster Branch, or whoever the equivalent now is, need to ensure that club/school/senior/junior etc issues are set aside and we have a plan to sustain, and ideally grow our game- at the social and professional/competive level.

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      #17
      24 players from Cork.
      9 players from Limerick.
      6 players from Tipperary.
      3 players from Waterford.
      2 players from Kerry.

      Comment


        #18
        Originally posted by ScrummieMan View Post
        24 players from Cork.
        9 players from Limerick.
        6 players from Tipperary.
        3 players from Waterford.
        2 players from Kerry.
        Ok so let’s weight that by population in catchment area, senior:junior clubs, kids in rugby playing schools etc and we might have the beginnings of a rational discussion about where the problems might lie/ what can/should be done.

        Comment


          #19
          Donal lenihan alluded to same thing after AIL final on sunday.
          said AIL and club struture vital to munster rugby and he said decline of clubs in limerick was v worrying .
          it needs to start at youth and underage level ,get them interested and playing early.
          I would think gaa will become more and more a factor too in limerick ,the academy and underage hurling in limerick is thriving and kids want to be their heroes .
          Still there's a light I hold before me
          You're the measure of my dreams
          The measure of my dreams.

          Comment


            #20
            Should we split the contribution of Cork to Cork and West Cork?

            On a serious note when rugby started to become about the private schools instead of the clubs, like Shannon and Garryowen going to war, we were always going to struggle.
            Club rugby is how Munster thrives, not through the schools. We don't have the same resources to compete with the Leinster schools and I'm pretty tired of feeling like we need to apologise for not having the same privilege as those in Leinster when it comes to their private schools. It’s infuriating.

            That said, from what I hear there is some serious talent coming through the academy. I don’t think we’ll see many, if any, big signings this year. They need to sort out the coaching staff, hopefully we sign a player or two but after signing the likes of Beirne and Carbery this season I expect this to be a quiet window.
            Last edited by Stringer9; 8th-May-2019, 23:47.
            The Maul is Back!! LONG LIVE THE MAUL!!

            Stringer is bigger even than his own immense shadow. Pound for pound, he is the best tackler in the world. If you put him into bag of cats he\'d come out without a scratch. He was hit very late for Murphy\'s try. And when he got up, as we knew he would, the crowd cried his name as if he had just fixed the economy.Billy Keane-After Munster\'s famous loss to the AB\'s.

            The Bull-Truly irreplaceable, a mountain of a man. 100 caps!!

            Comment


              #21
              Originally posted by Stringer9 View Post
              Should we split the contribution of Cork to Cork and West Cork?

              On a serious note when rugby started to become about the private schools instead of the clubs, like Shannon and Garryowen going to war, we were always going to struggle.
              Club rugby is how Munster thrives, not through the schools.
              .
              My point- and I know you get it- is that we need to look at what underpins those numbers- and why, if it is the case, one source of future talent is thriving in one area and not in another- and make sure that what we are doing is fully supporting rugby in that area.

              The clubs vs schools argument is sterile and divisive, we need a province wide plan that takes account of strengths and weakness in different area, and builds our talent pipeline in a way that suits the demographic of the game in Munster.

              Of course we should learn all we can from rugby development elsewhere, but we’d be foolish to think that what has worked well elsewhere is what we should be doing, just as we would be to assume that what has worked in the past will necessarily work in the future.
              Last edited by jagawayagain; 9th-May-2019, 07:25.

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                #22
                If the lack of players from Limerick continues, it does not bode well, long term.

                I'm not advocating a quota system, but if an area of the Province that has a long record of producing players of and above the required standard, stops, for whatever reason, producing them, then that reason must be identified and steps taken.

                Comment


                  #23
                  Originally posted by Piquet View Post
                  If the lack of players from Limerick continues, it does not bode well, long term.

                  I'm not advocating a quota system, but if an area of the Province that has a long record of producing players of and above the required standard, stops, for whatever reason, producing them, then that reason must be identified and steps taken.
                  And unfortunately that's no more than a rearguard action.
                  It's the Currows, Allihies, Hollyfords, Scarriffs and Helvics where progress lies
                  Gwan Joe!!

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Originally posted by Stringer9 View Post
                    Should we split the contribution of Cork to Cork and West Cork?
                    West Cork = 8 [James French, Josh Wycherley, Darren O'Shea, Fineen Wycherley, Gavin Coombes, John Hodnett, Darren Sweetnam, Liam Coombes]
                    Cork = 16 [James Cronin, Liam O'Connor, Stephen Archer, John Ryan, Brian Scott, Luke Masters, Kevin O'Byrne, Niall Scannell, Billy Holland, Peter O'Mahony, Jack O'Sullivan, Rory Scannell, Shane Daly, Alex McHenry, Sean French, Jonathan Wren]


                    PBC = 8 - Brian Scott, Niall Scannell, Peter O'Mahony, Jack O'Sullivan, Rory Scannell, Shane Daly, Sean French, Jonathan Wren.
                    CBC = 6.5 - Liam O'Connor, Stephen Archer, John Ryan, Luke Masters, Billy Holland, Alex McHenry, 0.5 [Liam Coombes]
                    Club Rugby = 5.5 - James Cronin, Kevin O'Byrne, Darren O'Shea, John Hodnett, 3 x 0.5 [Josh Wycherley, Fineen Wycherley, Liam Coombes]
                    Bandon GS = 3 - James French, Gavin Coombes, Darren Sweetnam

                    Wycherley spent 2 year each at Roscrea. 0.5 x 2
                    Liam Coombes spent 2 years at CBC Cork. 0.5 x 1

                    Breakdown of clubs:
                    Bantry Bay RFC - 2 [Josh Wycherley, Fineen Wycherley]
                    Clonakilty RFC - 1 [John Hodnett]
                    Highfield RFC - 1 [Kevin O'Byrne]
                    Ballincollig RFC - 1 [James Cronin]
                    Crosshaven RFC - 1 [Darren O'Shea]
                    Skibbereen RFC - 0.5 [Liam Coombes]

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Originally posted by ScrummieMan View Post

                      West Cork = 8 [James French, Josh Wycherley, Darren O'Shea, Fineen Wycherley, Gavin Coombes, John Hodnett, Darren Sweetnam, Liam Coombes]
                      Cork = 16 [James Cronin, Liam O'Connor, Stephen Archer, John Ryan, Brian Scott, Luke Masters, Kevin O'Byrne, Niall Scannell, Billy Holland, Peter O'Mahony, Jack O'Sullivan, Rory Scannell, Shane Daly, Alex McHenry, Sean French, Jonathan Wren]


                      PBC = 8 - Brian Scott, Niall Scannell, Peter O'Mahony, Jack O'Sullivan, Rory Scannell, Shane Daly, Sean French, Jonathan Wren.
                      CBC = 6.5 - Liam O'Connor, Stephen Archer, John Ryan, Luke Masters, Billy Holland, Alex McHenry, 0.5 [Liam Coombes]
                      Club Rugby = 5.5 - James Cronin, Kevin O'Byrne, Darren O'Shea, John Hodnett, 3 x 0.5 [Josh Wycherley, Fineen Wycherley, Liam Coombes]
                      Bandon GS = 3 - James French, Gavin Coombes, Darren Sweetnam

                      Wycherley spent 2 year each at Roscrea. 0.5 x 2
                      Liam Coombes spent 2 years at CBC Cork. 0.5 x 1

                      Breakdown of clubs:
                      Bantry Bay RFC - 2 [Josh Wycherley, Fineen Wycherley]
                      Clonakilty RFC - 1 [John Hodnett]
                      Highfield RFC - 1 [Kevin O'Byrne]
                      Ballincollig RFC - 1 [James Cronin]
                      Crosshaven RFC - 1 [Darren O'Shea]
                      Skibbereen RFC - 0.5 [Liam Coombes]
                      This is up there with Piquets masterful HCUP anslysis!!

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Underage internationals this season:

                        Prop

                        Josh Wycherley (Bantry Bay RFC/Roscrea) - u20
                        Luke Masters (CBC Cork) - u20
                        Mark Donnelly (CBC Cork) - u18a

                        Hooker
                        Billy Scannell (PBC Cork) - u20
                        Scott Buckley (CBC Cork) - u19

                        Lock
                        Paddy Kelly (St. Munchins College) - u19
                        Eoin O'Connor (Waterpark RFC) - u19
                        Thomas Ahern (Waterpark RFC) - u19
                        Jay Traynor (Waterpark RFC) - u18b

                        Backrow
                        John Hodnett (Clonakilty RFC) - u20
                        Alex Kendellen (PBC Cork) - u18a

                        Scrumhalf
                        Craig Casey (Ardscoil Ris) - u20
                        Charlie O'Doherty (Newcastle West RFC) - u19

                        Outhalf
                        Ben Healy (Glenstal Abbey) - u20
                        Jack Crowley (Bandon Grammar School) - u19
                        Cian Whooley (CBC Cork) - u18a

                        Centre
                        Sean French (PBC Cork) - u20
                        Harry O'Riordan (CBC Cork) - u18a
                        Jack Delaney (Crescent College Comprehensive) - u18b

                        Back Three
                        Jake Flannery (Rockwell College) - u20
                        Conor Phillips (Crescent College Comprehensive) - u20
                        Jonathan Wren (PBC Cork) - u20
                        Aaron Leahy (CBC Cork) - u18a

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Originally posted by ScrummieMan View Post
                          [B]
                          Keith Earls(31/St. Munchins/Young Munster) - contracted until 2021
                          Keith Earls(31/St. Nessan's/Thomond RFC) - contracted until 2021

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Limerick clubs are in trouble and would be event worse off if all the contracted players including the academy hadnt been directed there in recent years. Ive been involved in underage for a good while (not so much recently) and Limerick clubs just arent competing with the rest of their munster clubs. Dont know whats going on with club v school or competition with the blazers there or even the competition with GAA and soccer but its broken and needs fixing. I think the age grades are a big problem too with drop off in areas, the gap between u18 and u20 is massive.

                            As a guy living in Cork the west cork rugby clubs owe a huge debt to the GAA in the area, their skills and even strength and conditioning is all down to the training they are doing with the GAA clubs there and not some genious formula the underage sections there have. Dont mean to belittle the effort guys are putting in there, they would be the first to admit this themselves.

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Originally posted by wellboy View Post
                              Limerick clubs are in trouble and would be event worse off if all the contracted players including the academy hadnt been directed there in recent years. Ive been involved in underage for a good while (not so much recently) and Limerick clubs just arent competing with the rest of their munster clubs. Dont know whats going on with club v school or competition with the blazers there or even the competition with GAA and soccer but its broken and needs fixing. I think the age grades are a big problem too with drop off in areas, the gap between u18 and u20 is massive.

                              As a guy living in Cork the west cork rugby clubs owe a huge debt to the GAA in the area, their skills and even strength and conditioning is all down to the training they are doing with the GAA clubs there and not some genious formula the underage sections there have. Dont mean to belittle the effort guys are putting in there, they would be the first to admit this themselves.
                              Borne out too by Scrummieman’s post above on underage internationals- where there is a massive south Munster imbalance (this isn’t a cork vs Munster thing for me either- just linking so further support for your point).

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Originally posted by hellovating View Post

                                Keith Earls(31/St. Nessan's/Thomond RFC) - contracted until 2021
                                True, Neil Armstrong spent more days on the Moon than Earls did in Munchins
                                Nulla semper amicus, servivit mihi, in iniuriam mihi neminem quem non persolvi

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