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    Quinny v Axel



    Was just haviing a discussion into the merits of each player and when(if) Axel gets fit again who should slide in


    Quinlan Pros
    <UL>
    <LI>Excellant lineout option</LI>
    <LI>More Mobile</LI>
    <LI>Makes alot of big hits,not that Foley doesnt</LI>
    <LI>Can cover 7...running a bit short</LI>
    <LI>Intimidation Factor</LI>[/list]


    Foley Pros
    1. <LI>Inspiration</LI>
      <LI>Knows how to slow a ball down..without being caught</LI>
      <LI>Fantastic Brain...chips ahead and what not</LI>
      <LI>Intimidation factor</LI>



    Quinny Negatives:
    1. <LI>Disicpline..would Foley have been cited??</LI>
      <LI>Trys to act the "Hero" a little bit too much.Trying things that are'nt on</LI>
      <LI>Can get caught up in a revenge mode.Easier to put off game</LI>



    Foley Negatives:
    1. <LI>Legs arent what they used to</LI>
      <LI>Is shoulder really healed</LI>
      <LI>Is Leamy a better 8????</LI>



    Any thoughts???
    Shaqtastic...29 points

    #2


    Interesting point. Personally I think its equally as likely to beWallace or Leamy who misses out and the decision will be influenced by form and the style of side we are up against.


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      #3
      Can't see Leamy being left out of the team unless its to be rested.
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        #4


        I'd suspect a more likely situation is a rotation between the 4 of them on the rare occassions that all 4 are available. But I'd see Axel starting with Leamy most of the time and Wally/Quinny rotating between starting &amp; the bench. Though it would definitely be dependent on the opposition and the tactical plans.


        Axel wouldn't be much use coming off the bench (no offence, but not an impact player), wheras any of the other 3 could be brought in from the bench to make a change in tactics. I'd just suspect leamy is a guaranteed starter at this stage wheras wally/quinny are 2 different styles of player.
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          #5
          Quinny while on form and Foley off the bench and vice versa is the way to go.
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            #6


            Quinny is more of an impact player...He is more mobile, later on ina game more space and he can force errors.Leamy is a cert and i think so is Wally,has really matured into a World class 7 in the last year or so.More of a groundhog than ever, the Sale match last year


            Its between Quinny and Axel in my mind as we cant play Axel simply because of who he is,there has to be justified reasons
            Shaqtastic...29 points

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              #7


              Quinlan can play 6 and 7 , Leamy can play 6 and 8 , Wallace can play 6 and 7 (and 8 on attacking scrums close to the line) , Foley can play 6 and 8 ...


              With Leamy in this form , looks like the Magners league for Foley ...
              The Mike Gibson Appreciation Society

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                #8
                Foley has been a Munster great. I would think however that he will not force himself back into contention for a HEC starting place. To move Leamy from 8 would bewrong as his form there at the moment has pushed him into top 2 in the world IMO. Foley shouldplay an important role as Magners 8 and backrow cover for HEC. He'llstill be an important influence onthe squad and hisexperience and inspiration will be needed to retain the cup but he should only play as a sub in the HEC. Sentiment can't get in the way of the HEC defense. He was neverdropped by munsterand not regaining his place in what is now a settled backrow unit ( best in NH) is no disgrace. Quinnie, Wallace, Leamy for me.

                Comment


                  #9





                  Interesting comparison, in that they won't compete with each other directly, but Quinnie is the most likely to make way if Foley comes back.


                  Foley can't play at 6 - I don't think he'd mobile enough.


                  So if he's in, it's ahead of Leamy at 8 (I would argue an unlikely call at the moment, but they might decide that the main thing is having the Wallace/Foley/Leamy on the park).


                  If Foley does come in Leamy will be moved to 6 - and would get that ahead of Quinnie, I think.


                  None of the three would shift Wallace from 7.


                  So, in summation, I don't think Foley will make the HEC back row ahead of these 3 if they stay fit. If he does, it can only be at 8 and Quinnie will be sacrificed to keep Leamy on the park.


                  It's more complex then, than Leamy vs Foley. It's a question of whether a back row of Leamy, Wallace, Foley gives you more than a back row of Quinlan, Wallace, Leamy.


                  Will we get some of the cohesion we've been lacking with Axle back in the side? Hard to tell until he gets a run.


                  But I'd suggest that the passing of the captaincy marked a bit of a watershed - I don't think it would have happened if the expectation was that Foley would be playing week in week out.
                  "We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow

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                    #10
                    Originally posted by lahinch_lass


                    I'd suspect a more likely situation is a rotation between the 4 of them on the rare occassions that all 4 are available. But I'd see Axel starting with Leamy most of the time and Wally/Quinny rotating between starting &amp; the bench. Though it would definitely be dependent on the opposition and the tactical plans.


                    Axel wouldn't be much use coming off the bench (no offence, but not an impact player), wheras any of the other 3 could be brought in from the bench to make a change in tactics. I'd just suspect leamy is a guaranteed starter at this stage wheras wally/quinny are 2 different styles of player.


                    I don't disagree in terms of what's normally meant by impact sub, but if you were defending a 2 point lead with ten minutes to go, there's an awful lot he could offer.


                    You might not bring him on to change a game, but you could certainly bring him on to close one out.
                    "We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow

                    "Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy


                    "I think that progress has been made by two flames that have always been burning in the human heart. The flame of anger against injustice and the flame of hope that you can build a better world" - Tony Benn

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                      #11


                      interesting debate, one of riches really cos they are all class players:


                      For me it will Wally, Foley, Leamy to start with Quinny as impact from 60 on.


                      This assumes Foley gets back fit (healed) and back in shape, as earlier this season he had let his physical development slide and as a result would not pack near the punch of Quinny at the mo. So assuming he gets as fit as last year say W,F,L .
                      ____________________________________________
                      Munster were great when they were Munster.

                      alas they are just north munster now.......
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                        #12


                        Wrong heading lads - It's Munster v. the rest....!!!!!


                        As regards their merits, strengths, etc, can agree with many of the points above, but the one area that Axel stands above most rugby players of this era is Leadership - not mentioned above?


                        Are people also forgetting that 4 fit b-rowers is a MINIMUM for any top game these days (who are the first to be subbed in any game involving top sides?). The work-rate needed by modern b-rowers is phenomenal. France and Scotlandused to have the best around, then the Aussies and NZ'ers seemed to get ahead. Right now it's probably between ourselves and the Boks (all being fit). Foley is in that mould. Last person I saw to outplay him was Pat Lam - now who remembers the game?


                        Quinny is different fish to Foley, but a very effective one down through the years. EddieO'Sullivan wouldn't be coaching the Irish team right now but for him. Anyone remember his try in leading to our first CL title? We were lucky to have both great players at the same time.


                        The heading at the top of this thread is like asking Michael Winner would he prefer to drop his knife or his fork at the table.........

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by mike11


                          Quinny is different fish to Foley, but a very effective one down through the years. EddieO'Sullivan wouldn't be coaching the Irish team right now but for him.

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                          Comment


                            #14
                            We are blessed to be in a position to have such a discussion i.e. we have many top class BR forwards. I am (always was always will be) a huge Foley fan, however it will be hard to take the No. 8 jersey from Leamy at the moment.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Of topic slightly....if neither is available for the final two HEC group games, who willstart at6 ,7and 8 ?

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