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    #16
    Originally posted by Piquet View Post

    I have agreed with you above that the Ref can't see everything. Everybody understands that. The incident in the Castres match was one that he saw, viewed several times on the Big Screen and decided that a Yellow Card was sufficient.
    This decision was later found to be wrong, not by me, but by people far better qualified than I am, the Disciplinary Commitee, and the player was suspended.
    Yes. It happens with all refs. Not sure you can do anything about it. Refs in middle of game will make mistakes.

    Again why do we need this thread. Barnes has consistently shown himself to be best or one of best in the world. After this world cup assuming he is fit in September/October for the games he will have reffed the most games in a world cup of any referee.

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      #17
      Originally posted by ormond lad View Post
      Yes. It happens with all refs. Not sure you can do anything about it. Refs in middle of game will make mistakes.

      Again why do we need this thread. Barnes has consistently shown himself to be best or one of best in the world. After this world cup assuming he is fit in September/October for the games he will have reffed the most games in a world cup of any referee.


      Who’s forcing you to read it?

      Comment


        #18
        Barnes has also consistently shown himself to be prone to Howlers. He seems to me to be regularly overruled by Disciplinary Committees.

        OL, have you any comment to make on his decision, in the Castres game, to let the Citing Commissioner deal with an incident brought to his attention by one of the Captains, rather than asking his TMO to have a look?

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          #19
          Originally posted by Piquet View Post
          Barnes has also consistently shown himself to be prone to Howlers. He seems to me to be regularly overruled by Disciplinary Committees.

          OL, have you any comment to make on his decision, in the Castres game, to let the Citing Commissioner deal with an incident brought to his attention by one of the Captains, rather than asking his TMO to have a look?
          What do you see as regularly over ruled?
          I think ref was fine to let commissioner deal with incident. The ref and his team were confident on their on pitch decision and felt it should be left at that. I dont see why there should be criticism of that

          Comment


            #20
            You don't need to be on a sofa with the Sky+ remote to do an important part of your job and listen to a captain reporting an incident of the sort of foul play which would warrant a red card (eye-gouging), and ask the TMO to show you if there's anything he can find on the big screen provided to you for exactly that purpose. And in case you want to say something about too many stoppages - preventing the kind of incident which can cause serious injury, or long-term life consequences such as partial loss of sight, is far, far more important than the few moments of inconvenience it takes to investigate the issue during the game. If the opportunity to remove offenders at the time of the offence isn't taken, it gives them licence to do it again.

            As the referee, his primary responsibility is the safety and welfare of the players, and in that game he shirked it. Nobody should seek to defend him for it.
            Tis but a scratch.

            Comment


              #21
              Originally posted by ormond lad View Post
              What do you see as regularly over ruled?
              .

              Have a look at the first few posts on this thread.
              To mangle a Wildean quote, to be overruled once in a game is unfortunate, to be overruled twice, smacks of carelessness.

              Originally posted by ormond lad View Post
              I think ref was fine to let commissioner deal with incident. The ref and his team were confident on their on pitch decision and felt it should be left at that. I dont see why there should be criticism of that.
              Barnes made that decision on his own. He never involved "his team" (isn't the TMO part of the team as well?)

              Comment


                #22
                The calls about passes and scores are secondary really, they matter to the result of the game (sometimes) this one for instance
                https://www.balls.ie/rugby/watch-the...morning-336086

                But its his refereeing of illegal conduct that threatens the welfare of players that I find a major flaw of his approach.

                Comment


                  #23
                  Originally posted by Piquet View Post
                  Barnes has also consistently shown himself to be prone to Howlers. He seems to me to be regularly overruled by Disciplinary Committees.

                  OL, have you any comment to make on his decision, in the Castres game, to let the Citing Commissioner deal with an incident brought to his attention by one of the Captains, rather than asking his TMO to have a look?
                  I think that is correct conduct.
                  And again if a professional referee was consistently shown to be prone to howlers they would be quickly dropped from the panel in which they are reffing.
                  Do you have anything to prove he is overruled more than other refs?
                  I think his decision to let the citing commissioner make the decision was correct. WB and his team of officials decided in the moment that it wasnt worth a further look. The other officials would be in his ear on the mic saying to go upstairs if it warranted but they didnt.

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                    #24
                    POM, the Munster Captain remember, told him of an incident.

                    Mr Barnes, without asking his TMO, decided not to investigate it. He passed the buck, in other words.

                    As Mr Chips says above, where there is an accusation of serious foul play, it is the duty of the Ref to have it investigated Immediately. Not within 50 hours of kick-off. Not the following Wednesday or Thursday, immediately.

                    As Mr Chips says, if there is a Gouger on the pitch, that player needs to be removed immediately.

                    Anything less is deriliction of duty.

                    As I have said, repeatedly, I don't blame a ref for being unaware of an incident. If, however, the ref either sees an incident or is informed of the possibility of one, that's a different matter.

                    By the way, do you agree that he was mistaken when he awarded the Yellow Card late in the Castres game?



                    EDIT You are using a circular argument to support Mr Barnes. He wasn't wrong 'cos if he was, he would have been dropped or demoted. He wasn't demoted so he wasn't wrong.
                    I'm not aware of any Rugby Ref that has been demoted and has had that demotion publicly announced. Are you?
                    Last edited by Piquet; 7th-February-2019, 21:31.

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Originally posted by Piquet View Post
                      POM, the Munster Captain remember, told him of an incident.

                      Mr Barnes, without asking his TMO, decided not to investigate it. He passed the buck, in other words.

                      As Mr Chips says above, where there is an accusation of serious foul play, it is the duty of the Ref to have it investigated Immediately. Not within 50 hours of kick-off. Not the following Wednesday or Thursday, immediately.

                      As Mr Chips says, if there is a Gouger on the pitch, that player needs to be removed immediately.

                      Anything less is deriliction of duty.

                      As I have said, repeatedly, I don't blame a ref for being unaware of an incident. If, however, the ref either sees an incident or is informed of the possibility of one, that's a different matter.

                      By the way, do you agree that he was mistaken when he awarded the Yellow Card late in the Castres game?

                      EDIT You are using a circular argument to support Mr Barnes. He wasn't wrong 'cos if he was, he would have been dropped or demoted. He wasn't demoted so he wasn't wrong.
                      I'm not aware of any Rugby Ref that has been demoted and has had that demotion publicly announced. Are you?
                      It isnt passing the buck by not deciding to investigate an incident even if player asks someone to look at it. That regularly happens in game. Officials may be aware of something due to captain/players asking about it and not deem it worth of further action in game. It isnt deriliction of duty by not doing anything further

                      Comment


                        #26
                        - Sir he's pulling down as soon as we bind.
                        - I'll keep an eye. Crouch ...
                        Fine. Award a penalty or free kick if you see someone playing silly buggers, get on with the game.

                        - Sir one of my players has just been eye gouged.
                        - We'll let the citing commissioner look at it. I can't do anything about that.
                        Completely unacceptable. A total abdication of responsibility and the duty to protect the welfare of the players. If you are that steadfast in your refusal to acknowledge something as fundamental as this, you undermine your own credibility as an official - and I hope you never officiate at a game involving someone I care about.
                        Tis but a scratch.

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Originally posted by ormond lad View Post
                          It isnt passing the buck by not deciding to investigate an incident even if player asks someone to look at it. That regularly happens in game. Officials may be aware of something due to captain/players asking about it and not deem it worth of further action in game. It isnt deriliction of duty by not doing anything further
                          So the possibility that there is a Gouger in action in a game is " not worth of (sic) further action in game"

                          I think not.

                          Comment


                            #28
                            OL, any chance of an answer to these questions?

                            Originally posted by Piquet View Post
                            By the way, do you agree that he was mistaken when he awarded the Yellow Card late in the Castres game?

                            I'm not aware of any Rugby Ref that has been demoted and has had that demotion publicly announced. Are you?

                            Comment


                              #29
                              He certainly makes mistakes, but if he was that bad consistently he'd be out of a job surely?

                              p.s. He sent Hartley off for calling him a "f***ing cheat" so he's not all bad.

                              Sent from my CLT-L09 using Tapatalk
                              Last edited by Miguel Sanchez; 8th-February-2019, 12:34.
                              Yorn desh born, der ritt de gitt der gue,
                              Orn desh, dee born desh, de umn bork! bork! bork!

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Originally posted by Piquet View Post
                                OL, any chance of an answer to these questions?
                                Refs regularly are demoted be they refs from AIL level to junior or pro to lower levels... or refs from J2 to J1....
                                And Barnes could have given red but yellow was still correct.. Same as many other refs in all other games.

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