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Brexit referendum and negotiations 2016-19

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    As predicted further up this thread, yougov today is polling remain vs Brexit at 59/41.

    If that’s consistent, a people’s vote is unavoidable
    "We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow

    "Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy


    "I think that progress has been made by two flames that have always been burning in the human heart. The flame of anger against injustice and the flame of hope that you can build a better world" - Tony Benn

    Comment


      In the meantime, a homeless man died on the steps of parliament last night.
      "We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow

      "Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy


      "I think that progress has been made by two flames that have always been burning in the human heart. The flame of anger against injustice and the flame of hope that you can build a better world" - Tony Benn

      Comment


        Originally posted by Balla Boy View Post
        As predicted further up this thread, yougov today is polling remain vs Brexit at 59/41.

        If that’s consistent, a people’s vote is unavoidable
        Yes, but the fascinating & equally distressing thing about UK real politic thru 2018 is that no major party has come forward to champion a people's vote. There have been a few notable former leaders who have e.g. John Major, Tony Blair, etc but very few current MPs have publicly backed this pretty obvious option as yet.

        Indeed the irony is that many politicians e.g. Rees-Mogg, Gove & even May herself, keep reiterating the well spun (Brexit) mantra that they must deliver Brexit 'cos it is the democratic will of the British people.., '

        Yes, it was marginally that in the 2016 referendum, but in all likelihood, it is far from the democratic will of the British People in 2018. The politicians just don't want to consult the people to find out ~ go figure!?

        IMHO the British people deserve to be consulted on this deal & decision one more time. That should be the acid test imho.

        This Deal (Brexit) v Remain, SIMPLES!!
        Last edited by Daithi; 21st-December-2018, 10:53.
        ____________________________________________
        Munster were great when they were Munster.

        alas they are just north munster now.......
        ____________________________________________

        Comment


          "I don't believe in fairytales," O'Connell once told me, "even though it feels like I've been lucky enough to live through a few. However it ends, I'll feel lucky."
          Donald McRae, Guardian Rugby, October 2015

          Comment


            Originally posted by scotscor View Post

            I'm not sure I'd agree with that, if its the EU being beligerent after they have taken back the rules then at some stage there will be a rise in pro eu media, possibly including the Mail, blaming the government and the lies that the people were fed for the vote.
            It's already happening re the end of FOM. The British media are ramping it up asking why they should pay for visas. Also lots of articles about putting Ireland in its place.

            A no deal Brexit and the Sun, Express, Mail and Telegraph would have a field day blaming Johnny Foreigner.
            Please support Milford Hospice. Click here to donate.

            Comment


              http://waterfordwhispersnews.com/201...-back-control/
              "There are a lot of points that we’ve left behind and this is with a young group. That probably tells you what they’re capable of and that they’re a very good side.

              Probably next year or the year after next they will take some stopping"

              Anthony Foley, May 2016. Axel RIP

              Comment


                It was always on the cards, but Corbyn has confirmed he would go ahead with Brexit.
                ​​​​​​
                https://www.theguardian.com/politics...icy-leaving-eu
                Please support Milford Hospice. Click here to donate.

                Comment


                  Originally posted by fitzy73 View Post
                  It was always on the cards, but Corbyn has confirmed he would go ahead with Brexit.
                  ​​​​​​
                  https://www.theguardian.com/politics...icy-leaving-eu
                  Maybe he doesn't want to be prime minister?
                  "It’s not the team you support, it’s the club you should support. The team on the pitch will ebb and flow because that’s the nature of sport. No team has ever been successful decade on decade. The club has the history and that’s the passion you should have."

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Jenta View Post

                    Maybe he doesn't want to be prime minister?
                    More likey that Len McCluskey has bent his ear.

                    This could split the party in two.
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                    Comment


                      OK.
                      Time for a reality check.
                      The polls in the UK show no sign of a decisive swing against Brexit. So, forget a second referendum or a cancellation of A50. (I wish it were otherwise, but...)

                      It's the EU/May deal or no deal.

                      The Brits are puking about May's deal. That's their problem, not ours.

                      We should be crossing our fingers for May. Corbyn's Labour has walked off the pitch.

                      Comment


                        Have to admit I think 59:41 in favour of Remain is fairly decisive.

                        I think the amount of backlash against Corbyn's comments will force him to back down. His entire support base will crumble if he pursues this idiocy.
                        Tis but a scratch.

                        Comment


                          https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...t-peoples-vote
                          ____________________________________________
                          Munster were great when they were Munster.

                          alas they are just north munster now.......
                          ____________________________________________

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by mr chips View Post
                            Have to admit I think 59:41 in favour of Remain is fairly decisive.

                            I think the amount of backlash against Corbyn's comments will force him to back down. His entire support base will crumble if he pursues this idiocy.
                            Here's hoping!

                            If I read you-gov correctly, that's ''remain 59, May's Deal 41''. But (a) that might not be the referendum choice (b) How would the hard brexiters and the 'let's get on with it' bunch vote?

                            And in an increasingly nationalist UK unused to referendums, I wouldn't underestimate their ability to f..k it up all over again faced with what would be presented as a national humiliation.

                            Sorry, gloomy I know. Blame it on the solstice blues.
                            Last edited by aupa les rouges; 23rd-December-2018, 09:11.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by Daithi View Post

                              Yes, but the fascinating & equally distressing thing about UK real politic thru 2018 is that no major party has come forward to champion a people's vote. There have been a few notable former leaders who have e.g. John Major, Tony Blair, etc but very few current MPs have publicly backed this pretty obvious option as yet.

                              Indeed the irony is that many politicians e.g. Rees-Mogg, Gove & even May herself, keep reiterating the well spun (Brexit) mantra that they must deliver Brexit 'cos it is the democratic will of the British people.., '

                              Yes, it was marginally that in the 2016 referendum, but in all likelihood, it is far from the democratic will of the British People in 2018. The politicians just don't want to consult the people to find out ~ go figure!?

                              IMHO the British people deserve to be consulted on this deal & decision one more time. That should be the acid test imho.

                              This Deal (Brexit) v Remain, SIMPLES!!

                              Current MPs will only speak up if they're in overwhelmingly remain seats.

                              The others will (I suspect) take a passive voice. "We've tried to implement Brexit (so please don't punish us) and this is the best deal available (which we think is a **** show) and should be ratified by the people (so that we don't have to take responsibility for doing it".



                              I think the thing that will bring out a People's Vote is the number of MPs who will embrace the opportunity to say to their constituents "Wasn't me guv".
                              "We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow

                              "Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy


                              "I think that progress has been made by two flames that have always been burning in the human heart. The flame of anger against injustice and the flame of hope that you can build a better world" - Tony Benn

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by fitzy73 View Post
                                It was always on the cards, but Corbyn has confirmed he would go ahead with Brexit.
                                ​​​​​​
                                https://www.theguardian.com/politics...icy-leaving-eu
                                Unfortunately that’s the reality of it. Corbyn is very much an ani establishment Euroceptic. Maybe not as extreme Mogg, Johnson, Davis etc. He wants Brexit, and what’s to get elected at the back of it. He’ll stay on the side lines slinging mud like the rest, while in reality if in charge doing very little different.

                                Until Labour get rid of Corbyn, there won’t be a proper movement, opposition to Brexit politically.
                                "The PRO12 is our domestic league, it's what you earn your bread and butter from; it's what pays the bills. We need to broaden our emphasis and get an understanding in Irish rugby that the domestic league from now on is most important and that's what qualifies you now for Europe.'' Garrett Fitzgerald, CEO Munster

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