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Brexit referendum and negotiations 2016-18

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    Disaster for Labour and Tories in the local elections in England and Northern Ireland. Greatest benefits for Lib-dems, Greens (!!!) and independants who are all pro-remainers... Tories lost around 1100 seats on hour ago, labour and even UKIP lost voices too...
    After the ecological and climate emergency in Parliament, what does happen now in UK?.. Do they get their brain in the right position again?
    Last edited by JN.Allezdax.com; 3rd-May-2019, 17:41.
    "To be energetic and self-sufficing is to be happy; but while one desire remains in the heart happiness may not come there. For to desire is to be incomplete: it is the badge of dependence, the signal of unhappiness, and to be freed from that is to be freed from every fetter that can possibly be forged." (James Stephens, Deirdre)

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      Originally posted by JN.Allezdax.com View Post
      Disaster for Labour and Tories in the local elections in England and Northern Ireland. Greatest benefits for Lib-dems, Greens (!!!) and independants who are all pro-remainers... Tories lost around 1100 seats on hour ago, labour and even UKIP lost voices too...
      After the ecological and climate emergency in Parliament, what does happen now in UK?.. Do they get their brain in the right position again?
      Brain?! BRAIN!!!? What brain? Below an image of an ERG think tank:

      Click image for larger version

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        Originally posted by JN.Allezdax.com View Post
        Disaster for Labour and Tories in the local elections in England and Northern Ireland. Greatest benefits for Lib-dems, Greens (!!!) and independants who are all pro-remainers... Tories lost around 1100 seats on hour ago, labour and even UKIP lost voices too...
        After the ecological and climate emergency in Parliament, what does happen now in UK?.. Do they get their brain in the right position again?
        Unfortunately NO.
        Brain-function would indicate a withdrawal of Article 50.

        More likely is that Labour and Tories agree that they must make brexit happen asap.
        The deal will be done next week - May/Barnier deal with a fudge on Customs Union.

        Probably for the best, for the rest of the EU. The Brits would be intolerable if they stayed in at this stage.

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          Originally posted by the plastic paddy View Post

          And Farage will be in the EP elections, if they happen. The Brexit party is a different matter though. I can tell you, every Leaver I have spoken to is voting for Farage, the unanimity is astonishing. The local elections give no indication of the support for Remain, Brexit voters boycotted in droves. The amazing result from last night is Labour’s failure to exploit the lamest duck of a national leader in the history of the world ever. We all know May’s days are numbered but can Corbyn really continue after yesterday?
          Why would Brexit voters boycott local elections?

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            Not sure what Labour are playing at. 900 gains for LibDens and Greens suggests that they will take one hell of a beating in the Euros.

            Vince Cable is pick of the leaders for me - doesn't seem to have the compulsion to lie every time he opens his mouth.

            Gwan the LibDems
            ​​​​​​#GiveLeinsterTheHCupNow

            Originally Posted by mr chips
            AG gets the responses he does because he is a journalist..

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              Originally posted by whimpersnap View Post

              Why would Brexit voters boycott local elections?
              As a protest at their perception that their vote to Leave the EU has been ignored. It isn’t anecdotal either the numbers of spoilt ballots are shocking. Anyway, it looks like Labour are going to do whatever it takes to avoid a European election.

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                Originally posted by whimpersnap View Post

                Why would Brexit voters boycott local elections?
                Without the Brexit Party to vote for - they may have switched to indpendents or spoiled their vote or waiting for the Euros
                ​​​​​​#GiveLeinsterTheHCupNow

                Originally Posted by mr chips
                AG gets the responses he does because he is a journalist..

                Comment


                  Originally posted by AdolphusGrigson View Post

                  Without the Brexit Party to vote for - they may have switched to indpendents or spoiled their vote or waiting for the Euros
                  Or not bothered to turn out. Unbelievable things happening.

                  Comment


                    Seemingly there were 30000 spoiled votes - this may seem like a lot, but it's actually about 1% of the electorate.
                    Tis but a scratch.

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                      https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ms-over-brexit

                      Death to the enemies of de people!
                      AND naysayers. I'm looking at yew PP.

                      Comment


                        I think if Corbyn does a deal with the Torries over Brexit without a public vote, his chances of remaining Labour leader or becoming PM will be greatly diminished. There would be a major rebellion, 80% of Labour members want a people’s vote. He’d be acting against the parties interest. One which he surely wouldn’t survive. Seems Tom Watson is just waiting in the wings. The idea that the Conservatives & Labour will do a deal and Brexit will just fade away is folly.

                        One, they’ll have to get it through parliament. Two, the EU will have to agree with it. Three, even if the UK leaves, they’ll be a movement to rejoin. Since there’s an age differential in opinion towards the EU, with younger generation being very pro EU, and older very against. Actually remember seeing betting on PP, that the UK were odds on to rejoin the EU within 10 years of leaving. In 10 years time people will still be rabbiting on about Brexit and it’s consequences. It’s not going to end anytime soon.

                        After the local elections results, especially being the opposition party against a very weak conservative government, not to be hovering up the 1300 odd seats they lost, and to be actually lose so many themselves really damning. Corbyn has put his Euroceptic interests ahead of his parties interests. If there was a general election in the UK tomorrow, it’d be hard to see why the results wouldn’t mirror the local elections. Maybe Change UK might damage the Lib Dems. Hard to know.
                        "The PRO12 is our domestic league, it's what you earn your bread and butter from; it's what pays the bills. We need to broaden our emphasis and get an understanding in Irish rugby that the domestic league from now on is most important and that's what qualifies you now for Europe.'' Garrett Fitzgerald, CEO Munster

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                          Once the UK leaves the EU (which I still think is most likely) who thinks the EU would have them back ? The EU are fully aware that the UK (largely due to its press fueling it) will never stop whingeing on - why would they allow them back in ? In 10 years the Germans will have worked out how to sell just as many cars, there will be neither political will nor economic requirement to have them back in.
                          I can certainly see a big French “NON” at the very least.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by plastic View Post
                            Once the UK leaves the EU (which I still think is most likely) who thinks the EU would have them back ? The EU are fully aware that the UK (largely due to its press fueling it) will never stop whingeing on - why would they allow them back in ? In 10 years the Germans will have worked out how to sell just as many cars, there will be neither political will nor economic requirement to have them back in.
                            I can certainly see a big French “NON” at the very least.
                            It’s a good point, Charles de Gualle famously denied them entry twice fearing to this situation. And in many ways I wish they did leave the EU, as they have become quite a toxic member with Farages UKIP and now Brexit party. But the social and economic consequences for Ireland, Scotland, Gibraltar, even Wales who voted for it etc. could be grave. Which Brexiteers just see as collateral damage.

                            Also having lived in England, the fact is the majority of people simply don’t understand what the EU actually is. Complete failure in there education system IMO, which can be seen through there inability understand the really of there former empire. I think that’s one reason there so fixated of WW2, almost as a denial of there own misdeeds. I actually think Brexit could have the opposite effect intended and could actually lead to a more aware generation less likely to be so easily fooled by old propaganda tricks of grandeur.
                            "The PRO12 is our domestic league, it's what you earn your bread and butter from; it's what pays the bills. We need to broaden our emphasis and get an understanding in Irish rugby that the domestic league from now on is most important and that's what qualifies you now for Europe.'' Garrett Fitzgerald, CEO Munster

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by plastic View Post
                              Once the UK leaves the EU (which I still think is most likely) who thinks the EU would have them back ? The EU are fully aware that the UK (largely due to its press fueling it) will never stop whingeing on - why would they allow them back in ? In 10 years the Germans will have worked out how to sell just as many cars, there will be neither political will nor economic requirement to have them back in.
                              I can certainly see a big French “NON” at the very least.
                              You may well be right. It may not be a NON though. It may be that the bar is set so high - no rebate on contributions and a requirement to join the Euro which will be unpalatable to the English for at least 20 years.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by KerryRed View Post

                                It’s a good point, Charles de Gualle famously denied them entry twice fearing to this situation. And in many ways I wish they did leave the EU, as they have become quite a toxic member with Farages UKIP and now Brexit party. But the social and economic consequences for Ireland, Scotland, Gibraltar, even Wales who voted for it etc. could be grave. Which Brexiteers just see as collateral damage.

                                Also having lived in England, the fact is the majority of people simply don’t understand what the EU actually is. Complete failure in there education system IMO, which can be seen through there inability understand the really of there former empire. I think that’s one reason there so fixated of WW2, almost as a denial of there own misdeeds. I actually think Brexit could have the opposite effect intended and could actually lead to a more aware generation less likely to be so easily fooled by old propaganda tricks of grandeur.
                                It's been usefully observed that the UK is the only country in Europe in which WW2 is remembered as a moment of triumph and celebration rather than a national tragedy.

                                "We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow

                                "Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy


                                "I think that progress has been made by two flames that have always been burning in the human heart. The flame of anger against injustice and the flame of hope that you can build a better world" - Tony Benn

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