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  • Major TNT
    replied
    Originally posted by mickiemcfist View Post

    I'm guessing you're not particularly young...
    Covid aside, that style of living is exactly what many of my colleagues (c. 30 year old Multinational, highly paid tech staff) would like.
    You get to have a little community even if you just landed in Dublin for a job you've more than likely been headhunted for & know nobody here. These people are single, their job looks after their meals, laundry etc. & they work long hours so usually come home, go to bed & code or watch netflix. It's not a long term thing & it certainly wouldn't suit me, but I just can't fathom why people (other than those across the road) would object to the concept.

    Like any business it'll only work if the demand is there, so let them build it & fail if you think it's such a terrible idea. People aren't being forced to live there. It's also not cheap as they're exceptionally well fitted, guaranteed the fit & finish would surpass any house under c €2m in Dublin. It's not a "I can't afford an apartment so I'll co-live" kind of thing.

    Look at the gallery here of one I've visited out of curiosity as a friend lived there, 300m from Stephens green: https://node-living.com/gallery.html
    COVID ASIDE? WTF.
    Dismissing a global pandemic? Are you serious, covid and what could very possibly follow it is another cast iron reason NOT to follow through on nonsensical co living tenements.
    They are being pushed by developers and the politicians they have in their pocket to make even more profit.

    With thousands more working from home where on earth are people going to put office desks in totally unsuitable co living buildings?
    Last edited by Major TNT; 1-September-2020, 14:49.

    Leave a comment:


  • rathbaner
    replied
    Originally posted by mickiemcfist View Post

    Is it awful that kids are growing up in hotels? Yes, but ...
    Just ... disgusting. You probaly like the idea of children in cages too, like in the US.

    One day you may lose your job. When that day comes I hope, for your families sake, you don't have to deal with people like you.

    Leave a comment:


  • Jenta
    replied
    Jesus christ, that was like reading something scrawled on the wall of the jacks in the Daily Express offices.

    Leave a comment:


  • mickiemcfist
    replied
    Originally posted by rathbaner View Post

    I suppose it's just that many people get justifiably angry at the priorities in housing that our society demonstrates. That it's more important that developers and landowners maximise profits, than it is that our children aren't allowed to grow up in emergency housing (hotel rooms) with all the long term damage to society that causes.
    I think there's been fairly significant long term damage done to society by the idea that people who don't work at all can have free houses & have as many kids as they like & get more social welfare. Those kids take that as an example & it's a never ending cycle. I think those that can't work should be absolutely looked after, moreso than they currently are. Ultimately private businesses are going to prioritise profit over the greater social good, that's their purpose. If the government want to step in & build more council estates for those who won't bother working for their childrens future, they'll have to compete with the private businesses for staff. Is it awful that kids are growing up in hotels? Yes, but we've created a state where in a lot of cases you're better off living in a hotel for a couple of years, so you can have a free house for the rest of your life.

    An example is Margaret Cash, appropriate second name as she had a net income of 52k per year in social welfare, equivalent of 78k gross for you & me. She could afford to rent somewhere but chose not to. If those sort of people were weeded out of the housing lists we could provide for those that actually need help.

    (My attitude may come across as that of some sort of upper class twat, however it's the opposite, I came from a single parent household where my mother worked in a low paid job, which worked out less profitable than not working at all, but she instilled the value of work to me & my siblings & ensured we studied & had a different life)

    Leave a comment:


  • rathbaner
    replied
    Originally posted by mickiemcfist View Post

    Valid concern, but if these people don't move into co-living, they'll live somewhere. So they're a pressure release valve for the rest of the housing market & (objections aside) a very quick way of housing a high amount of people that would otherwise live across less suitable 2/3 beds which could house families. There's 111 beds in the Merrion road plan, that's potentially up to 50 units of housing freed for other people. I have no dog in the fight per se as I have a family so they're not suitable for me, but for many of my peers they're a great solution but it irks me when the proposals are shot down with blindly unaware comparisons to tenements. There was a time in my life where I'd have loved to live in one of them.
    I suppose it's just that many people get justifiably angry at the priorities in housing that our society demonstrates. That it's more important that developers and landowners maximise profits, than it is that our children aren't allowed to grow up in emergency housing (hotel rooms) with all the long term damage to society that causes.

    Leave a comment:


  • mickiemcfist
    replied
    Originally posted by rathbaner View Post

    I understand your point. My beef is that - notwithstanding the temporary availability of AirBnB apartments caused by the lockdowns and restrictions - that the need for homes remains unmet. Meanwhile the only building going on are hotels or things like this, the smallest conceivable units for the highest imaginable rent.
    Valid concern, but if these people don't move into co-living, they'll live somewhere. So they're a pressure release valve for the rest of the housing market & (objections aside) a very quick way of housing a high amount of people that would otherwise live across less suitable 2/3 beds which could house families. There's 111 beds in the Merrion road plan, that's potentially up to 50 units of housing freed for other people. I have no dog in the fight per se as I have a family so they're not suitable for me, but for many of my peers they're a great solution but it irks me when the proposals are shot down with blindly unaware comparisons to tenements. There was a time in my life where I'd have loved to live in one of them.

    Leave a comment:


  • rathbaner
    replied
    Originally posted by mickiemcfist View Post

    They start from c.2k a month for a single room, there are a multitude of cheaper alternatives in Dublin (929 rooms in Dublin under 600 per month on Daft). You think people fleeing poverty are looking at 2k rooms on Merrion road?

    The people complaining most about these are the people who know next to nothing about the market they appeal to. They're 30ish year olds on over 100k per year. Not planning on living in Ireland forever but maybe for a few years. Co-living suits as they can live in relative luxury but still be able to save for a house home etc. Also there's value in living with people with similar interests, be it networking or socialising.
    I understand your point. My beef is that - notwithstanding the temporary availability of AirBnB apartments caused by the lockdowns and restrictions - that the need for homes remains unmet. Meanwhile the only building going on are hotels or things like this, the smallest conceivable units for the highest imaginable rent.

    Leave a comment:


  • mickiemcfist
    replied
    Originally posted by rathbaner View Post
    I'm not sure that's correct, given the absence of affordable alternatives.
    They start from c.2k a month for a single room, there are a multitude of cheaper alternatives in Dublin (929 rooms in Dublin under 600 per month on Daft). You think people fleeing poverty are looking at 2k rooms on Merrion road?

    The people complaining most about these are the people who know next to nothing about the market they appeal to. They're 30ish year olds on over 100k per year. Not planning on living in Ireland forever but maybe for a few years. Co-living suits as they can live in relative luxury but still be able to save for a house back home etc. Also there's value in living with people with similar interests, be it networking or socialising.

    Leave a comment:


  • rathbaner
    replied
    Originally posted by mickiemcfist View Post

    People aren't being forced to live there.
    I'm not sure that's correct, given the absence of affordable alternatives.

    Leave a comment:


  • mickiemcfist
    replied
    Originally posted by Major TNT View Post
    Hopefully another nail in the coffin for former FG failure Eoghan Murphy's pet project, nonsensical co living modern day tenements.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/business/...plan-1.4338689

    Chief executive of Arytza Kevin Toland and his wife Aisling are opposing the five-storey Bartra Capital proposal for 98 Merrion Road.

    In their one-page objection, the Tolands cite Covid-19 fears and urge Dublin City Council to “please reject this planning application”.

    “Covid-19 has struck every country in the world, the very nature of co-living would have the potential of spreading the virus even further. It could endanger the local community at large, ” said the Tolands.

    “We were very surprised that a proposal of this nature would even be considered during a world-wide pandemic.”
    I'm guessing you're not particularly young...
    Covid aside, that style of living is exactly what many of my colleagues (c. 30 year old Multinational, highly paid tech staff) would like.
    You get to have a little community even if you just landed in Dublin for a job you've more than likely been headhunted for & know nobody here. These people are single, their job looks after their meals, laundry etc. & they work long hours so usually come home, go to bed & code or watch netflix. It's not a long term thing & it certainly wouldn't suit me, but I just can't fathom why people (other than those across the road) would object to the concept.

    Like any business it'll only work if the demand is there, so let them build it & fail if you think it's such a terrible idea. People aren't being forced to live there. It's also not cheap as they're exceptionally well fitted, guaranteed the fit & finish would surpass any house under c €2m in Dublin. It's not a "I can't afford an apartment so I'll co-live" kind of thing.

    Look at the gallery here of one I've visited out of curiosity as a friend lived there, 300m from Stephens green: https://node-living.com/gallery.html

    Leave a comment:


  • Waterfordlad
    replied
    I would take anything Kevin Toland says with a pinch of salt. He’s presided over a heap of **** at Arytza. Their share price in Dublin In May 2017 was 32 euros a share, down to less than a euro now, and investors are voting to oust him.

    Leave a comment:


  • Major TNT
    replied
    Hopefully another nail in the coffin for former FG failure Eoghan Murphy's pet project, nonsensical co living modern day tenements.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/business/...plan-1.4338689

    Chief executive of Arytza Kevin Toland and his wife Aisling are opposing the five-storey Bartra Capital proposal for 98 Merrion Road.

    In their one-page objection, the Tolands cite Covid-19 fears and urge Dublin City Council to “please reject this planning application”.

    “Covid-19 has struck every country in the world, the very nature of co-living would have the potential of spreading the virus even further. It could endanger the local community at large, ” said the Tolands.

    “We were very surprised that a proposal of this nature would even be considered during a world-wide pandemic.”

    Leave a comment:


  • cornerboy
    replied
    Time to reintroduce internment I fancy.

    Leave a comment:


  • Major TNT
    replied
    FG's Phil Hogan returned from brussels, didnt quarantine as he should have. And went to the gold society party in galway. Time for him to resign also.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/poli...ally-1.4335751

    Politicians and public figures among more than 80 people attending an Oireachtas Golf Society dinner during Covid-19 restrictions “should leave public life and do something else”, a leading public health expert has insisted.

    Dr Gabriel Scally, president of epidemiology and public health at the Royal Society of Medicine in London, said he was shocked and saddened over revelations about the large gathering at the Station House Hotel in Clifden, Co Galway, on Wednesday.

    Mr Kelly said EU Commissioner Phil Hogan and Supreme Court Justice Séamus Wolfe – both of whom were in attendance – would need to be having “very strong conversations” on Friday about their role in public life.

    “I think Phil Hogan’s position [as EU Commissioner of Trade] is not tenable,” he said.

    “I think the standard set by Dara Calleary’s resignation applies across the board. It was a massive misjudgment, it was totally wrong. People saw what was going on there, and, even if they weren’t aware beforehand they should have left.”

    Mr Hogan’s response, in a tweet, that he had been assured the event complied with Government guidelines was a “laughable excuse”, said Mr Kelly.

    “He didn’t even offer an apology,” he added, suggesting Mr Martin could express no confidence in the commissioner to the EU if he were not to resign.

    “If Séamus Wolfe was still the attorney general, I don’t think his position would be tenable either,” said Mr Kelly.

    Leave a comment:


  • jagawayagain
    replied
    Originally posted by rathbaner View Post

    Well pro or anti Treaty is immaterial now 100 years on. IMHO partition benefitted no one, not in Ireland and not in Britain. The alternatives might not have been any more palatable but I think we can all say that the populations of both north and south suffered in what Connolly correctly predicted would be a "carnival of reaction" in both parts of Ireland.

    The north was no more enlightened than the south through the 30s, 40s and 50s and arguably a more brutal society if you were among the most disadvantaged. And the north had ready access to investment capital from Britain, unlike the south, and yet failed to take advantage of it to create a welcoming or prosperous society for all of its citizens post WW2.

    The result of this failure was a disaster on any measure. But the NI economy had become a dependency by then. Most British people are at best utterly uninterested or at worse hostile to its continued existence.

    As for the south, a near bankrupt new state unable to borrow was only too willing to offload responsibilities to the RCC, Ireland wasn't the only country to be railroaded by them in the 20s and 30s. Spain and Italy suffered a similar fate and with much more serious consequences. The RCC is not an innocent bystander here.

    As for the North, it can hardly defend the union with Scotland now walking out the door. Scotland will surely leave the UK at the next opportunity, given the failure of the last three Tory governments to provide any reason whatsoever to remain.

    According to the latest census only 30% of under 10s in NI come from a Unionist background. In other age groups Unionists are also at a disadvantage except for the generation born in the1920s. Those under 10s will be of voting age in 2030-2040. It's fairly clear that NI is already on borrowed time.

    On the upside, Belfast and Co Down would boom immediately if it became part of the east coast Irish boom, I'd imagine it would quickly overtake Cork as the second centre of the Irish economy if partition ended, given the low wage expectations and property prices there.

    But it's about more than just economics really isn't it?

    You might be interested in this discussion about the NI and southern economies from David McWilliams, a southern Irish economis married to a woman from the East Belfast unionist tradition, or tribe, as he calls it.



    Also an interesting thread on Twitter by this guy which sheds interesting light on the south's struggling economy in the 40s and 50s and the choices it made. It's here https://twitter.com/CMacCaba/status ...924914688?s=20
    Click image for larger version

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    Thank you- I look forward to reading those sources- it may seem we are some way apart, but I suspect not really. As to whether the treaty matters a century on, it was the only material difference between the two political parties which have dominated our history- that they are now in coalition, together recognises both the irrelevance of that distinction, and the policy vacuum that they share. Reducing the number of alternatives to voting for SinnFein, is a monumentally stupid strategic mistake.

    Leave a comment:

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