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    Originally posted by mr chips View Post
    We're in NI but since I'm still shielding, my brother is self-quarantining by camping here since he got back from several months in Spain at the weekend. Was going ok till last night, when his tent let the rain in for what he insists is the first time. Going to get a big canvas tent set up for him tomorrow when it's dry.
    Ah let him get wet its good for the soul.
    Excellence is hard to keep quite - Sherrie Coale

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      Originally posted by fitzy73 View Post

      It's not mandatory but in fairness it's would be bad form to be out and about. The guidelines are fairly explicit about staying indoors.
      Yeah I get ya and agree. I came back 5 weeks ago and did my 2 weeks indoors.

      I’m just really interested in why governments seem to be deliberately confusing people. I think they want to stress guidelines as much as they can to have them appear as law but they actually aren’t. I think then x amount of the population reads it as mandatory and Y does not. In most cases X is enough in terms of an amount of people they need to comply. It’s just interesting to me.

      As for the green list, if the U.K. just happened to be on it, I don’t know why anyone who yesterday thought they should quarantine for 14 days upon return(in line with a guideline) would chose not to quarantine Now. The virus has not changed its position. This has nothing to do with your situation, I’ve just been pondering the strange advice.
      The whole world cries out peace, freedom and a few less fat bastards eating all the pie.

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        So, even a trip home is not recommended, for anything less than 3 weeks, otherewise you have to stay in self quarantine, then leave again...
        I wonder do they accept any form of documentation saying that I took a test and don´t have Covid-19...

        Spain wasn´t on the green list, looks like I can´t go visit home for a long time....
        And then more quarantine when I return here...
        He was as lame as a duck. Not the metaphorical lame duck either, but a real duck that was actually lame. Maybe from stepping on a land mine or something.

        Comment


          Originally posted by i_like_cake View Post
          So, even a trip home is not recommended, for anything less than 3 weeks, otherewise you have to stay in self quarantine, then leave again...
          I wonder do they accept any form of documentation saying that I took a test and don´t have Covid-19...

          Spain wasn´t on the green list, looks like I can´t go visit home for a long time....
          And then more quarantine when I return here...
          live in Virginia, had planned a beach holiday in Rhode Island (8 hours drive to the NE). Because Va COVID test positivity > 5% we required a negative COVID test result to allow us to travel. Or else quarantine for 14 days.
          Testing widely available here so testing per se not a problem. But wait times for results are 3-5 days or even more. Even for sick people. To be valid your test has to be within 72 hours.
          Now, RI rules are not really enforceable, they dont have cops on the road checking out of state cars, but at the same time we wanted to follow the rules, and take reasonable precautions to not be vectors to a state which has done a good job on containment (after a rough time of it in April)
          We canceled, lucky enough to get a refund, and will do something local instead
          So testing delays have a real impact not just on public health but also the economy. And travel rules are never going to be legally enforceable mandates but rather guidelines on behavior.
          We chose to not travel, others will decide otherwise.
          And rules are not watertight all they are doing is reducing probabilities. On an individual basis you can get infected but at a population level these measures will reduce the RO

          Comment


            Originally posted by i_like_cake View Post
            So, even a trip home is not recommended, for anything less than 3 weeks, otherewise you have to stay in self quarantine, then leave again...
            I wonder do they accept any form of documentation saying that I took a test and don´t have Covid-19...

            Spain wasn´t on the green list, looks like I can´t go visit home for a long time....
            And then more quarantine when I return here...


            They've rolled testing into the process here. So you arrive in the UAE, you do a test at the airport on your way in, you quarantine and in 24-48hrs you get your test result. If you're all clear you're out and about, if your positive they come and fetch you off to the hospital and track and trace whoever you've come into contact with.

            The testing is so important. 14 day quarantines don't do anything if people with mild symptoms then start moving around. They'll slow down overall transmission, but it seems to me an approach that's predicated on not overwhelming the testing capacity.
            "We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow

            "Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy


            "I think that progress has been made by two flames that have always been burning in the human heart. The flame of anger against injustice and the flame of hope that you can build a better world" - Tony Benn

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              Originally posted by MunsterTel View Post

              Hi Fitzy, not that i would condone it, but what's stopping you going outside if you went home? The self isolation is a request, not mandatory isn't it?!
              I was in my local Aldi the other day, guy on the phone, saying yes, he's back, (from US), then said he was following the procedures.. but that it didnt mean total isolation.. just precautions.. he was wearing a mask.. i moved further away.
              Nulla semper amicus, servivit mihi, in iniuriam mihi neminem quem non persolvi

              Comment


                New R-rate figures for GB, which include post pub opening period look pretty good- below 1 everywhere (the + to - range indicates that the broken down by region the numbers aren't very robust, despite overall sample size c20k. Nationally it's 0.7-0.9, falling by -1 to -4%. That, and retail sales figures reported to be back to pre-lockdown levels, suggest things are coming along nicely (that's a bit distorted as retail figures normally higher in June/July than March anyway).


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                  How many people have recovered from the virus and are now effectively immune according to the S Korea CDC? It should be possible for these folk to attend public places and events if they are willing to carry proof, say on their passport or mobile phone.
                  Everyone's desperate to reopen the economy safely and here's a reservoir of folk who could could help.

                  Edit: 25,000 who tested positive are recovered, but many more must be revoered who were never tested.
                  Last edited by rathbaner; 24-July-2020, 14:51.
                  Munster – Champions of Europe 2006, 2008, 2020.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by rathbaner View Post
                    How many people have recovered from the virus and are now effectively immune according to the S Korea CDC? It should be possible for these folk to attend public places and events if they are willing to carry proof, say on their passport or mobile phone.
                    Everyone's desperate to reopen the economy safely and here's a reservoir of folk who could could help.

                    Edit: 25,000 who tested positive are recovered, but many more must be revoered who were never tested.
                    I think the issue is we don't know how long those people are immune for? And if immunity is limited then they can get reinfected and become infectious again
                    I think the science is being conservative on this
                    Lots of anecdotal evidence of reinfection but nothing rigorous and most scientists say there is some immunity but careful to not say what the extent of it is

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by Yatenga View Post

                      I think the issue is we don't know how long those people are immune for? And if immunity is limited then they can get reinfected and become infectious again
                      I think the science is being conservative on this
                      Lots of anecdotal evidence of reinfection but nothing rigorous and most scientists say there is some immunity but careful to not say what the extent of it is
                      Unlikely. Immunity,like that acquired from infection, is the basis of all vaccines. There's no evidence of reinfection. Where it appeared to be the case, as in S Korea, they investigated and showed that folk are immune once they recover. Of course there's no guarantee it'll last forever but w for now we know it lasts at least 8 months.
                      Munster – Champions of Europe 2006, 2008, 2020.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by rathbaner View Post

                        Unlikely. Immunity,like that acquired from infection, is the basis of all vaccines. There's no evidence of reinfection. Where it appeared to be the case, as in S Korea, they investigated and showed that folk are immune once they recover. Of course there's no guarantee it'll last forever but w for now we know it lasts at least 8 months.
                        You’re probably right, but if the virus mutates, then we would expect immunity. Relatively speaking the number of cases has been low, and thus even if those who recover are safe, there are very many more of us to be infected.

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by jagawayagain View Post

                          You’re probably right, but if the virus mutates, then we would expect immunity. Relatively speaking the number of cases has been low, and thus even if those who recover are safe, there are very many more of us to be infected.
                          WHO got into trouble for saying there was no evidence of immunity from reinfection. Which was technically true. But they could have just as easily said there was no evidence of reinfection. Even if most or all experts think there has to be some level of immunity but nobody is prepared to say for how long or to what extent
                          Given the type of virus and how quickly it mutates (apparently slower than most coronaviruses but faster than a lot of others) most vaccine experts think a vaccine will only be moderately effective and of short lived benefit. Like flu shots
                          But really they dont know
                          The question that intrigues me is that nobody is prepared to say that it could mutate into a relatively benign virus. To paraphrase Trump it could just go away. Sort of what happened to the 1918 flu
                          I dont know if thats because they dont want to create false hope or its just statistically unlikely that that could happen in a relatively short time-frame (months say).

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by Yatenga View Post

                            The question that intrigues me is that nobody is prepared to say that it could mutate into a relatively benign virus. To paraphrase Trump it could just go away. Sort of what happened to the 1918 flu
                            I dont know if thats because they dont want to create false hope or its just statistically unlikely that that could happen in a relatively short time-frame (months say).
                            I guess it's the same reason that climate scientists are so reticent to blame climate change for a particular instance of extreme weather. It's a shame there isn't a a strong collective political voice for scientists, but it's the nature of the beast. If they got one thing wrong in their predictions they'd be dismissed as idiots so the public arena is surrendered to the idiocracy of politicians who can tell outright lies and know that they'll probably get re elected anyway..
                            Munster – Champions of Europe 2006, 2008, 2020.

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                              Originally posted by Yatenga View Post

                              WHO got into trouble for saying there was no evidence of immunity from reinfection. Which was technically true. But they could have just as easily said there was no evidence of reinfection. Even if most or all experts think there has to be some level of immunity but nobody is prepared to say for how long or to what extent
                              Given the type of virus and how quickly it mutates (apparently slower than most coronaviruses but faster than a lot of others) most vaccine experts think a vaccine will only be moderately effective and of short lived benefit. Like flu shots
                              But really they dont know
                              The question that intrigues me is that nobody is prepared to say that it could mutate into a relatively benign virus. To paraphrase Trump it could just go away. Sort of what happened to the 1918 flu
                              I dont know if thats because they dont want to create false hope or its just statistically unlikely that that could happen in a relatively short time-frame (months say).
                              No one wants to be wrong, unless it’s a positive outcome, then the gloom mongers will simply put it down to caution. There is also a media element which thinks that we all want to hear/ read the someone is to blame, or a new even worse crisis is at hand.Preaching false hope as Trump did was foolish and tragic, but a bit of balance wouldn’t go amiss.

                              Comment


                                Well Kilkee looked like great craic last night if you were a teenager
                                "Some people don't know their easy lives... I wouldn't be so ungrateful" - Fiacre Ryan - #AutismAndMe

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