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    Originally posted by Piquet View Post
    So temperature and Global Warming are not related?

    Water vapour is always present in the atmosphere.
    1. Yes they are.

    2. Agree.

    But neither point supports your argument much.

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    "I don't believe in fairytales," O'Connell once told me, "even though it feels like I've been lucky enough to live through a few. However it ends, I'll feel lucky."
    Donald McRae, Guardian Rugby, October 2015

    Comment


      If, as you agree, temperature and Global warming are related, how can you say that while water vapour affects temperature, it doesn't affect Global Warming?



      My argument is that Water Vapour is a greenhouse gas.

      Comment


        Originally posted by Piquet View Post
        My argument is that Water Vapour is a greenhouse gas.
        And I agree 100% with you.

        But we differ on the impact that this particular GHG has on climate change.

        Respect for your arguments though.


        Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
        "I don't believe in fairytales," O'Connell once told me, "even though it feels like I've been lucky enough to live through a few. However it ends, I'll feel lucky."
        Donald McRae, Guardian Rugby, October 2015

        Comment


          Question re canvassing, does anyone feel any doorstep dialogue makes a shred of difference to politicians beliefs or decisions?
          "Some people don't know their easy lives... I wouldn't be so ungrateful" - Fiacre Ryan - #AutismAndMe

          Comment


            Originally posted by Piquet View Post

            What's "no longer true"?

            By the way, Hydrogen can, relatively easily, be got by the electrolysis of water.
            It's no longer true that "cars aren't, and never will be, cleaner than Public Transport per person travelling." Especially in Ireland (north or south), zero-emission buses and trains are few & far between. Moreover, the provision of public transport outside of major urban centres is nowhere near as widespread as it could or should be. EVs are becoming more affordable, more widely available and more suitable for most travellers' requirements, including rural dwellers like me.

            In the example I gave of mrs chips above, there are no zero-emission options for her to get to work, nor is there a prospect of such for years to come even if an unprecedented investment in zero-emission public transport were to be announced this week - not highly likely! However, even an older and battery-degraded Leaf would allow her to drive her 7000km annual commute emitting zero greenhouse gases - not even water vapour. We have a solar array at home and there's one on the roof of her place of work as well, so weekend and weekday charging are available without needing to burn any combustion fuel at all, whether from a filling station or in a power plant. Of course, a more up-to-date EV with four times the range would only need to be fully charged up once a week to do this, but even a used minimum range EV would also be sufficient for the additional approx 3000km p.a. we would cover in going to nearby towns for various shopping/social etc purposes - places which again are poorly/not at all served by public transport from here (e.g. we can be in Ballymoney in under 15 minutes by car, or 90 minutes using the convoluted bus links which only go twice a day).

            I know that hydrogen can be obtained through electrolysis of water, but when the issue of zero emissions is key to this particular discussion, what is the energy demand and what are the carbon emissions involved in doing so? Currently less than 5% of hydrogen globally is produced using renewable means. How much scaling up of infrastructure will be required to replace current fossil fuel demand with renewably-produced, zero emission (i.e. not just at the tailpipe) hydrogen? Electricity is leagues ahead in this regard.
            Tis but a scratch.

            Comment


              Electric trains or trams or buses will always be cleaner per person carried than electric cars.

              I agree that the main argument is how the electricity is generated.

              Hydrogen generation is being explored as a method of storage of energy generated during periods of, say, high wind for use when the winds are low and demand is high.

              Comment


                Originally posted by Hugged Rugger View Post
                Question re canvassing, does anyone feel any doorstep dialogue makes a shred of difference to politicians beliefs or decisions?
                We put up a no canvassing sign on the front door.


                Best decision we made in a while. Was being riddled with the bastards every evening.

                I would ban plastic campaign posters and flyers in my first hundred days as supreme leader
                I am the million man.

                Comment


                  Originally posted by Waterfordlad View Post
                  Are you both saying the same thing, that hydrogen ain’t all it’s sometimes cracked up to be?
                  Lets not split hairs here
                  I am the million man.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Hugged Rugger View Post
                    Question re canvassing, does anyone feel any doorstep dialogue makes a shred of difference to politicians beliefs or decisions?
                    They talk to you every 4 years or so to get elected that's about the sum of their interest in you the voter.

                    Excellence is hard to keep quite - Sherrie Coale

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by blackwarrior View Post

                      Increased water also leads to increased cloud formation which deflects sunlight back into space, also reducing the amount of sun radiation hitting the earth’s surface. Both of these have a negative effect on temperature. So just calling water vapour a greenhouse gas doesn’t tell the whole story.


                      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

                      yes, i think you guys are on the ball regarding water vapour. it has become a major issue due to huge to degradation of our soils, due to loss of carbon from them and depletion of organic matter leading to much less water been retained in the worlds soils

                      Comment


                        Latest

                        Ireland, Red C poll:

                        SF-LEFT: 24% (+5)
                        FF-RE: 24% (-2)
                        FG-EPP: 21% (-2)
                        GREEN-G/EFA: 7% (-1)
                        LAB-S&D: 5% (+1)
                        SD-S&D: 3%
                        AONTÚ-*: 2% (+1)
                        S-PBP-LEFT: 1% (-1)

                        +/- vs. 16-22 Jan

                        Fieldwork: 25-30 January 2020
                        Sample size: 1,000
                        Polling average: https://t.co/Pjh0Ruzgg3
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                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Piquet View Post
                          Electric trains or trams or buses will always be cleaner per person carried than electric cars.

                          I agree that the main argument is how the electricity is generated.

                          Hydrogen generation is being explored as a method of storage of energy generated during periods of, say, high wind for use when the winds are low and demand is high.
                          If the electricity powering the trains/buses is generated from renewable sources to the same extent as that powering electric cars, I can certainly see an argument for them being as clean (where clean = zero emissions of either greenhouse gases or toxic pollutants/carcinogens etc). I'm interested in your grounds for saying that they will always be cleaner - are you talking about other factors such as microparticulates from tyres/brake dust etc, or something else? In any case, we are sadly a long way from that being the overriding concern - with trains and buses, diesel is still king.

                          At the moment, I see hydrogen as a viable alternative to fossil fuels for maritime shipping, for urban buses/trams, probably for trains and possibly for HGV road transportation. But in terms of energy storage, to me batteries look like being a safer, cheaper, more scaleable and easier to implement solution than hydrogen, especially when vehicle-to-grid or even vehicle-to-home becomes more commonplace.
                          Tis but a scratch.

                          Comment


                            We can reduce the Carbon Footprint of all vehicles to negligible amounts over (a long) time but we'll never get it down to zero.

                            Thus, per person carried, public transport will always be cleaner.

                            Comment


                              You're using a hypothetical scenario to make an absolute claim. In today's reality, private cars are a necessary component of the overall transport system. Yes, there could and should be a much more comprehensive public transport infrastructure, let alone one powered by renewable, zero emissions fuel sources, but there isn't - and there's no imminent prospect of drastic improvement in this situation. It is possible right now to drive an EV powered by anywhere from 33% to 100% zero emissions electricity. For the foreseeable future, this will be a cleaner, less polluting option than travelling by a public transport system powered almost completely by fossil fuels.

                              But I think this is getting further from the topic of the thread, so I'll resist the temptation to delve into it any more. Come back to me when buses fuelled by hydrogen, or any other power source produced using zero emissions, are the norm!
                              Tis but a scratch.

                              Comment


                                We will.never eliminate "private" transport, granted but we should be making it easier for people to use public transport in future. In the greater scheme of things, it's the cleaner option.

                                Comment

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