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    #16
    Originally posted by ustix View Post
    I think personally that the players have played ever so well under Gatty. They've achieved a lot. I suppose you could always design a poll if you wish to establish how a broader base of people view the matter
    No need for a poll. I thought he has done well with the teams.


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      #17
      Originally posted by The Last Stand View Post
      Did they over or underachieve with Gatland?


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      Based on the state of their provincial game, you'd have to say "over" in certain patches, but it's hard to say overall. He had patches that would have seen another coach sacked, and a lot of his purple patches seemed to come about as much by luck as judgment as injury forced certain changes.

      He's been reluctant to let go of a once winning formula at times, but did he have the players for a more expansive game? I'd have my doubts.
      "We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow

      "Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy


      "I think that progress has been made by two flames that have always been burning in the human heart. The flame of anger against injustice and the flame of hope that you can build a better world" - Tony Benn

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        #18
        Overall I think he has overachieved, if you take the success of the individual Welsh sides vs that of the national side during his era in charge (from late 2007) and compare it to our own. Ospreys won the league twice, Scarlets once, while Irish sides have won the thing seven times. In Europe, Scarlets made it to a European semi-final this year and in 2008, while Cardiff and Ospreys have each made the quarters once, in 2010 and 2012 respectively. Ireland on the other hand tend to have at least two representatives at the knockout stages in Europe almost every year (2016 being the exception).

        At international level during the same era, Wales got the slam in 2008 and 2012, as well as winning the championship in 2013, while we got the slams in '09 and '18 with narrow championship wins in '14 and '15. But that doesn't allow for Gatty having taken time out for the Lions, with a series win against Australia and draw against NZ. He has also brought Wales to a RWC SF - something we've not managed yet ...
        Tis but a scratch.

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          #19
          Originally posted by mr chips View Post
          Overall I think he has overachieved, if you take the success of the individual Welsh sides vs that of the national side during his era in charge (from late 2007) and compare it to our own. Ospreys won the league twice, Scarlets once, while Irish sides have won the thing seven times. In Europe, Scarlets made it to a European semi-final this year and in 2008, while Cardiff and Ospreys have each made the quarters once, in 2010 and 2012 respectively. Ireland on the other hand tend to have at least two representatives at the knockout stages in Europe almost every year (2016 being the exception).

          At international level during the same era, Wales got the slam in 2008 and 2012, as well as winning the championship in 2013, while we got the slams in '09 and '18 with narrow championship wins in '14 and '15. But that doesn't allow for Gatty having taken time out for the Lions, with a series win against Australia and draw against NZ. He has also brought Wales to a RWC SF - something we've not managed yet ...
          I hope the yet comes about soon.


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            #20
             

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