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What have we learnt from SA tour???

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    What have we learnt from SA tour???

    Well to my mind the 2 most important things we have learnt is that Furlong and Jackson are deserving their place in the Irish 23 and are pushing for starting positions.
    Also learnt that when players are fit we have a lot of competition in backrow - POM/Ruddock/Stander/Heaslip/SOB/JVDF/TOD/Henry/Murphy with Henderson also an option so that we can mix and match.

    We need to develop stronger depth at 1/2/3/9/10/12 - if we could develop some back 3 backs with the power of guys like North/Savea etc it would help

    If we can get Healy/SOB fit for a period of time and could put out something like this - McGrath, Best, Ross, Toner, Henderson, POM, SOB, Heaslip - Healy, Cronin, Furlong, Dillane, Stander it would give us a pack with a replacement bench to match nearly anyone...
    Last edited by In Joe we trust; 19th-June-2016, 12:06.

    #2
    Not "learned" so much as we've known it for some time, particularly in the loss to a limited England team at Twickenham a few seasons back, but we desperately need to develop enough depth to be able to get some impact from the bench. We need some big, crashy ****ers coming on with 15 to go.
    "We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow

    "Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy


    "I think that progress has been made by two flames that have always been burning in the human heart. The flame of anger against injustice and the flame of hope that you can build a better world" - Tony Benn

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      #3
      The tour isn't over so probably too early for a post mortem. A win next week and it is a spectacular success.

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        #4
        Gawrjussnuss is no longer a requirement.
        The Beatings Will Continue Until Morale Improves

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          #5
          We have learned once again that spoofing never wins.
          Yorn desh born, der ritt de gitt der gue,
          Orn desh, dee born desh, de umn bork! bork! bork!

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            #6
            I've learned I don't miss rob Kearney at full back at all, at all, at all. Not even a smidgen.
            Last edited by Boo-boo; 19th-June-2016, 19:56.
            Tic-Toc. POC and DOC. Stop the clock.

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              #7
              Originally posted by Boo-boo View Post
              I've learned I don't miss rob Kearney at full back at all, at all, at all. Not even a smidgen.
              Even Aussiedub, or whatever he calls himself these days, would have to admit that, although he won't.


              Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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                #8
                I've learnt (not for the first time) that domestic politics and international rugby don't make good bedfellows.
                New infraction avoidance policy: a post may be described as imbecilic, but its author should never be described as an imbecile.

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                  #9
                  Addressing some of the original comments;

                  - Furlong and Jackson have been sensational. Losing Ross or Sexton has been a big fear for too long. Now we have genuine competition never mind options.
                  - Imagine having everyone fit in the backrow? Would certainly provide us with impact off the bench. Running with O'Mahony, O'Brien, Heaslip, Stander in our first 23 certainly gives massive impact off the bench.
                  - Depth at 1: Kilcoyne is a decent player but because of how good McGrath is, he's a fair step down. Hopefully Buckley coming back will give us another option. He's looked decent the last two years. Personally I'm not writing Healy off. He's not looked a test level prop in some time, however with a decent layoff and hopefully getting over his injuries, having him, Buckley and McGrath gives us options. We still can't write off Cronin either as he's still relatively young in prop years.
                  - Depth at 2: Think we have decent options with Cronin and Strauss. However the age profile is a little troubling and there is no one standing out behind them (McCartney aside who is also getting on).
                  Depth at 3: Once Ross goes we're down to the bare bones and White is a similar age. Moore has looked a decent option and Bealham is young too and will learn from this tour. Not massively worried relative to a few years ago.
                  Depth at 9: Genuine worry. Where are the young stars?
                  Depth at 10: Similar to 9, but at least there are developed options. Jackson, Sexton and Madigan have all had test time. Hopefully Holland and Johnston can kick on and would be nice for JJ's career to start at some stage.
                  Depth at 12: Not sure about this, we seem to have loads of decent 12's. Olding, Marshall, Henshaw, McCloskey, Scannell.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Kevin77 View Post
                    Addressing some of the original comments;

                    - Furlong and Jackson have been sensational. Losing Ross or Sexton has been a big fear for too long. Now we have genuine competition never mind options.
                    - Imagine having everyone fit in the backrow? Would certainly provide us with impact off the bench. Running with O'Mahony, O'Brien, Heaslip, Stander in our first 23 certainly gives massive impact off the bench.
                    - Depth at 1: Kilcoyne is a decent player but because of how good McGrath is, he's a fair step down. Hopefully Buckley coming back will give us another option. He's looked decent the last two years. Personally I'm not writing Healy off. He's not looked a test level prop in some time, however with a decent layoff and hopefully getting over his injuries, having him, Buckley and McGrath gives us options. We still can't write off Cronin either as he's still relatively young in prop years.
                    - Depth at 2: Think we have decent options with Cronin and Strauss. However the age profile is a little troubling and there is no one standing out behind them (McCartney aside who is also getting on).
                    Depth at 3: Once Ross goes we're down to the bare bones and White is a similar age. Moore has looked a decent option and Bealham is young too and will learn from this tour. Not massively worried relative to a few years ago.
                    Depth at 9: Genuine worry. Where are the young stars?
                    Depth at 10: Similar to 9, but at least there are developed options. Jackson, Sexton and Madigan have all had test time. Hopefully Holland and Johnston can kick on and would be nice for JJ's career to start at some stage.
                    Depth at 12: Not sure about this, we seem to have loads of decent 12's. Olding, Marshall, Henshaw, McCloskey, Scannell.
                    Re. Depth at 1 - Buckley is very good, getting evn better and is fairly young. A good bet for McGrath's backup. Expect McCall to kick on next season top. Interesting to see ifHealy can haul himsely back. A great LH at his best but not at the races this year.

                    Re. Depth at 2 - not sure either Strauss or Cronin is up to it at international level, especially the former, though Cronin is a dangerous player in the loose towards the end of a game. I'd have McCartney and Herring ahead of both.

                    Re. Depth at 3 - As you mentioned- Furlong. Outstanding yesterday. If he can play that well against a SA front row he's OK. I'd view Bealhan as aTH too, where he's not bad and getting better. Herbst will also be IQ -a t his best, very good, but injury problems this year. Moore has much potential. Playing in England will not make him ineligible - will just be harder for him to crack the squad.

                    Re. Depth at 9. Marmion is a good SH with attacking flair and a great break. He should be given more game time off the bench. Agree that after him it starts to look thin. McGrath promised a lot but has not kicked on. Stringer is not bad at 38.

                    Backrow : Stander was our best forward in the 6N. Heaslip has had an impressive renaissance and show great consistency. Henderson is a beast. POM is top class. Ruddock has really stepped up, is abrasive and physical. TOD is in consideration. v.d Flier was the man in possession of the 7 shirt but may find it hard to relclaim. He may be overtaken by the traditional 7 young Dan Leavy of Leinster, who I think shows even more promise. Connacht players McKeon and Sean O'Brien are big fast, athletic, can play across the back row and are totally underrated. They are also young and improving. Chris Henry has a couple of years left in him and was showing form at the end of the season. Then there's Jack O'Donohue, Conan and Masterson. Sean O'Brien (Lenister) may find it difficult to crack the team now, given his injury history (could we not convert him to a hooker or Prop?) I have not even mentioned Murphy or Reidy whom I rank well behind several others in this list; or John Muldoon who should really be in SA right now. Hendo will probably play lock to allow other backrowers a slot on the team. Ruddock can play lock at a pinch too. Wish the rest of the team had the same strength in depth as the backrow.

                    Midfield and wings : there are plenty of good players on the Ireland scene. So many I can't be bothered listing all. Coming up with the best combination is the challenge here.

                    FB: Payne and O'Halloran are well ahead of the rest, including R. Kearney. Would not rule out Zebo for his speed and natural attacking tendencies - he just needs to tighten up a bit and know when to take the safety option. He can be a match winner (or loser).
                    Erse end of nowhere

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                      #11
                      Originally posted by Viigand View Post
                      The tour isn't over so probably too early for a post mortem. A win next week and it is a spectacular success.
                      We've already seen some of the positive effects of selective squad rotation between big games and more active user of the bench in games also. Hopefully Js (&/or his successor) will continue with this in the AIs and 6Ns & next Rwc,etc .

                      The tour is only 2/3 s over, so hopefully these boys see out the deal now to r round out with a win at sea level in Port Elizabeth and round out what would t then be an excellent tour for the Ireland squad Go Ireland!!!
                      ____________________________________________
                      Munster were great when they were Munster.

                      alas they are just north munster now.......
                      ____________________________________________

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                        #12
                        So far:

                        A) That attack is the best form of defence.
                        B) That young Tadhg Furlong is the rising tide.
                        C) That Naomh Joe remains the man.
                        Gwan Joe!!

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                          #13
                          I didn't see the whole game. I did see that the backline got a combined rest of 3min, with TOH coming on at 77min. Given the bravery of the first 15 selection I don't get what a few more changes weren't made in last 20 min. Especially when you consider where the game was played and how wrecked lads were.

                          Would Marmion with 5 mins played have made the tackle Murray missed with 75 min played. He would surely at least have got on him, I just don't get it.

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                            #14
                            So far we have learnt that there is a game left.

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                              #15
                              So far we have learnt we can actually win in SA.
                              Excellence is hard to keep quite - Sherrie Coale

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