A word from our sponsors

Collapse

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Form Irish 23

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Munsterboy
    replied
    Originally posted by mr chips View Post
    But, but ... what about all the ineffectiveness we keep hearing about?
    There's a pattern whenever some good Leinster back row emerges: the usual suspects start saying that whichever Munster player is starting for Ireland in said position is not in form and must be replaced immediately. Evidence doesn't really come into it.

    After CJ repeatedly made a mockery of such claims about his form, they've moved on to POM.

    Leave a comment:


  • mr chips
    replied
    But, but ... what about all the ineffectiveness we keep hearing about?

    Leave a comment:


  • dropkick
    replied
    https://mobile.twitter.com/SamLStand...29726409125888

    Interesting chart on backrows during the world cup that measured defence and attack. POM was the second best defensive backrow in the tournament according to the numbers.

    Leave a comment:


  • Sulla
    replied
    Dave Kearney ahead of Earls after this weekend

    Leave a comment:


  • In Joe we trust
    replied


    Originally posted by In Joe we trust View Post
    If we were picking a form 23 for the Irish team to start the 6Nations how would it look and how will it change over the next few weeks.

    My form team would be -
    Healy, Kelleher, Porter, Ryan, Henderson, Ruddock, VDF, CJ, Cooney, JJ, Conway, McCloskey, Farrell, Earls, Larmour - Buckley, Herring, Furlong, Toner, Jordi, Blade, Sexton, Haley/Scannell
    Some changes required based on injury/performance.

    Healy, Herring, Porter, Ryan, Henderson, CJ, VDF, Doris, Cooney, Byrne, Stockdale, McCloskey, Ringrose, Conway, Larmour - Killer, Scannell, Furlong, Toner, Connors, Blade, Carberry, Scanell

    Kelleher/Sexton missing due to injury

    Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

    Leave a comment:


  • In Joe we trust
    replied
    Originally posted by Munsterboy View Post

    You’re right. It’s more the quality of opposition like Lyon that do that.
    Still think it's the quality of opposition?

    Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

    Leave a comment:


  • Benji
    replied
    Originally posted by ustix View Post
    There was a strong and instantaneous response to the rise of Buccaneers in the AIL years ago. Should but can't remember who it was that amalgamated with Athlone to make it happen
    They joined with Ballinasloe. Good for a period of time but imho didn’t work .

    Leave a comment:


  • Munsterboy
    replied
    Originally posted by In Joe we trust View Post
    Considering that most people on here believe that Killer, Scannell, POM, CJ, Beirne should be in the ireland 15/23 ahead of members of the Leinster pack surely you cant be claiming the Leinster pack is that much superior that t gives Ross Byrne an easy ride?

    Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
    You’re right. It’s more the quality of opposition like Lyon that do that.

    Leave a comment:


  • In Joe we trust
    replied
    Originally posted by dropkick View Post
    Ross Byrne does the basics very well but I think we need players who can do more than the basics. Otherwise it's just like having another Kearney. I'm not knocking Rob Kearney but I'd prefer all the backs to have some bit of a running threat with the exception of the 9 but if the 9 has a running threat then it's a bonus.


    leinster can get by without RB being a threat but international rugby is a step up. I think Carbery is firmly in the driving seat. Ther3s a lot of talented 10s coming through. In the next season or two I think Harry Byrne and Ben Healy could become important players if they play to their potential. That's just 2 of many.


    It's also worth noting that RB plays behind a pack that dominates most games. He has plenty of time and space to pull the strings.
    Considering that most people on here believe that Killer, Scannell, POM, CJ, Beirne should be in the ireland 15/23 ahead of members of the Leinster pack surely you cant be claiming the Leinster pack is that much superior that t gives Ross Byrne an easy ride?

    Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

    Leave a comment:


  • Finnegan79
    replied
    Originally posted by dropkick View Post
    Ross Byrne does the basics very well but I think we need players who can do more than the basics. Otherwise it's just like having another Kearney. I'm not knocking Rob Kearney but I'd prefer all the backs to have some bit of a running threat with the exception of the 9 but if the 9 has a running threat then it's a bonus.


    leinster can get by without RB being a threat but international rugby is a step up. I think Carbery is firmly in the driving seat. Ther3s a lot of talented 10s coming through. In the next season or two I think Harry Byrne and Ben Healy could become important players if they play to their potential. That's just 2 of many.


    It's also worth noting that RB plays behind a pack that dominates most games. He has plenty of time and space to pull the strings.
    So does Sexton when he plays well. He didn't win player of the year and a the double playing behind a pack getting its ass handed to it. People slagging Byrne are engaging in serious confirmation bias, looking for reasons why he isn't good and writing it off as "he plays for a good team" when he does well. Carbery does have a higher ceiling, but he can't stay fit. Hopefully he comes back at 100% and stays that way or close to it, but I'm not naive enough to think that will be the case given his short career yet lengthy injury history.
    Last edited by Finnegan79; 26-December-2019, 03:26.

    Leave a comment:


  • jagawayagain
    replied
    Originally posted by dropkick View Post


    He gave a good interview. Looks like he has identified where Schmidt went wrong and will put his own stamp on the culture and style of play.
    I really hope so- we could do without a tribute act.

    Leave a comment:


  • dropkick
    replied
    Originally posted by Cowboy View Post
    I watched Farrell's interview in the rugberdome (Abbotstown). I was heartened by what he said, he pointed out that sending the players Carol singing on Grafton was about making them 'comfortable with being uncomfortable' and they were having Santa visit after training for the players families. He also pointed out how important it was for the players to give back via charity and their time. All small little nods I felt to previous regimes

    It's a small thing and you could view it from many angles but the slate is now clean and he's worth his shot at the gig. I wish him and those around him nothing but success

    He gave a good interview. Looks like he has identified where Schmidt went wrong and will put his own stamp on the culture and style of play.

    Leave a comment:


  • dropkick
    replied
    Ross Byrne does the basics very well but I think we need players who can do more than the basics. Otherwise it's just like having another Kearney. I'm not knocking Rob Kearney but I'd prefer all the backs to have some bit of a running threat with the exception of the 9 but if the 9 has a running threat then it's a bonus.


    leinster can get by without RB being a threat but international rugby is a step up. I think Carbery is firmly in the driving seat. Ther3s a lot of talented 10s coming through. In the next season or two I think Harry Byrne and Ben Healy could become important players if they play to their potential. That's just 2 of many.


    It's also worth noting that RB plays behind a pack that dominates most games. He has plenty of time and space to pull the strings.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mumhain
    replied
    Originally posted by Finnegan79 View Post

    Nobody wearing a green jersey looked like they were ready for international rugby that day. Honestly I think the perception around Byrne has been seriously influenced by the fact that we've been sold Carbery as the heir apparent for such a long time now that it is ingrained in our minds that he is for sure the backup to Sexton b/c he is far and away a better player despite the fact that Byrne has played well in many big games and not all of them have been against pushover teams. Cullen and Lancaster preferred him as the backup 10, the reason being Carbery could cover 15 so they played him there more often. Seemed to make sense but I have to wonder if that is actually the case or did they think that Byrne was a better fit for what they wanted to do ? Did they think/know Carbery was injury prone based on how they saw him train ? We don't know and possibly never will.

    As for the rest of them, right now Carty is out of form, but played well last weekend when he came on, Hanrahan has done well all season and fully deserves a legitimate chance at making the 6N squad. Burns is playing well; the kicking issue reminds me of Wales with Halfpenny and Biggar. Biggar is a great kicker, Halfpenny was world class off the tee,so he took the kicks. Maybe it isn't that Burns can't get it done off the tee, its just that Cooney is just a notch above. At any rate, Cooney should be starting so it won't matter who the 10 is behind Sexton. The kicking duties would shift to Cooney is he is on the pitch.
    Some fair points, but I'm not sure about the whole Byrne was always selected ahead of Carbery at fly-half argument. I know the Leinster-based media like to spin it that way, but the reality is that Byrne was never selected ahead of Carbery in a big game at 10. The only reason Byrne was ever picked at 10 ahead of/with Carbery at 15, was because (A) Carbery was returning from international rugby fixtures and Leinster needed to adhere to the IRFU player welfare policies and (B) Leinster knew that Carbery was too good not to be starting somewhere and didn't want to lose him. They were fully intent on converting him to 15 so that they could get himself and Johnny into the first team.

    I think Cullen and Lancaster always rated Carbery as the superior outhalf. Let's not forget Ross Byrne, Cathal Marsh and Joey Carbery were all fit and available for selection at the start of the 2016 season. Joey Carbery was selected to start vs Castres in the champions cup first round and he kept getting selected ahead of Byrne until Johnny Sexton regained full fitness.

    I hope Byrne will go on to do good things for Ireland, but at the moment, I think there are better alternatives who have proven themselves more. There were a number of players who under-performed in the England warm-up game debacle, but that doesn't excuse Byrne's individual performance. He was poor in a number of areas. The first one being in defense - where he was consistently giving up easy metres and defending passively. Because of this, the entire back-line had to come in an extra few meters and it meant Ireland were defending with less width. The second being the decision making in attack. He executes all the fundamentals( especially kicking and passing) well, but to play an expansive game you need a fly-half who can really read the game well. Sometimes, especially in that England game and for Leinster this season, it looks like he has made his decision to kick without taking into account the changing defense he's facing.

    Again, I'm sure he can rectify these areas, but until we see him get a consistent run of game time, it will be very difficult for him to proof himself.

    Last edited by Mumhain; 25-December-2019, 22:39.

    Leave a comment:


  • Spiffy
    replied
    Originally posted by Munsterboy View Post
    If Burns should be up the pecking order for steady, consistent performances, Byrne should too. He’s very solid.

    Carty will be back and I wouldn’t be surprised to see his form improve from here on. His try against us, throwing that dummy and going himself, was the act of a strong, stubborn character.

    Not all that much between JJ, Byrne, Burns and Carty, and there are a few more emerging of similar quality.

    Joey has a higher ceiling than all of them IMHO but he has a bit of work to do, if he can stay fit.
    Byrne's own brother Harry has looked very good for Leinster as has the highly talented Frawley. At the moment I'd go for the solid but unspectular big brother Byrne as Jonny's international understudy. He can run a game quite well, does the basics but is starting to show bit of self confidence and running ability that was previously missing. I would not care if Sexton misses the 6N. I want to see the younger lads become embedded in the team.
    Carbery seriously needs a long run of injury-free, good performances to nail the shirt long term. His reputation is better than his actual record.
    Connacht's Fitzgerald could be a dark horse if he keeps it up for a couple of seasons.

    Leave a comment:

Working...
X