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Japan v Ireland, 08.15, Sat 28 Sept

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  • The Last Stand
    replied
    Originally posted by ormond lad View Post
    Japanese wouls be far more accostomed to it being at home and it is very lazy to say players lacked passion, pride.
    Again you say very lazy but quite frankly Ireland showed up expecting to win. Perhaps better to say that Ireland lacked hunger while Japan had bucketloads.

    I also highlighted the fact that they looked off their feet and perhaps this is not fitness but overtraining.

    Have a look at the demeanour/body language of the Irish players during the anthems last week against Scotland and against Japan??
    Last edited by The Last Stand; 30th-September-2019, 17:36.

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  • Spiffy
    replied
    Originally posted by Talking Sense View Post
    Poor old Jack Carty, picking him in a game of this magnitude was a huge error from Joe. If Sexton cant start 2 games in a row then he should have been jettisoned months ago and Joey made first choice. Sexton needed to start this game and get us into a secure place before emptying the bench. Joe getting off very lightly around these parts IMO.
    Carty has been getting some undeserved flack. He was no worse that his teammates and created two tries for Ireland by clever and adventurous play. Nobody has said much here about the laboured slow ball he was getting from ruck and maul the whole game. Hard to do much with that, even if you are Sexton. If Carty is to be knocked for his performance, so then must Connor Murray who increasingly takes forever to clear the ball, but largely seems above critisizm.

    Again, on reading the stream above, and at the risk of pissing off the regulars :

    It is NOT Carberry - it is Carbery.
    It is
    NOT Carthy - it is Carty.

    FFS offenders wud yiz sharpen up and get it right before these lads reach retirement age.

    Leave a comment:


  • ormond lad
    replied
    Originally posted by The Last Stand View Post

    Maybe it is lazy to say it but it certainly was not evident. Very cool and calm is not always an asset.

    Of course humidity and heat were a factor but I was the same for both teams.
    Japanese wouls be far more accostomed to it being at home and it is very lazy to say players lacked passion, pride.

    Leave a comment:


  • The Last Stand
    replied
    Originally posted by ormond lad View Post
    Think its lazy to say they lacked passion, pride etc.
    Was conditions, humidity a factor?
    Maybe we have aimed to peak for quarters and got caught out by a well coached home side.
    Maybe it is lazy to say it but it certainly was not evident. Very cool and calm is not always an asset.

    Of course humidity and heat were a factor but I was the same for both teams.

    Leave a comment:


  • Munsterboy
    replied
    Originally posted by ormond lad View Post
    Think its lazy to say they lacked passion, pride etc.
    Was conditions, humidity a factor?
    Maybe we have aimed to peak for quarters and got caught out by a well coached home side.
    Exactly. All this very simplistic stuff about "not showing up" etc. is ignoring some fairly obvious external factors, and Japan's quality too.

    I thought they were playing very well for the first 20, they were ok for another 30, and then they really struggled for the last half an hour.

    To me that screams fatigue, which is not all that surprising given the conditions. As I pointed out in a previous post, apart from being used to the heat and humidity, the Japanese had freshened up their pack, despite facing weaker opposition in their preceding game and having more recovery time.

    Leave a comment:


  • ormond lad
    replied
    Originally posted by The Last Stand View Post

    Well said. Hats off to Japan but what I am
    still struggling with is that we lacked passion, urgency, pride and drive. Where was the leadership? Why were they complacent?

    Why was someone like Ryan who is supposedly Uber fit looking wreaked from early on? Were they trained too hard or perhaps trying to peak for the quarters?
    Think its lazy to say they lacked passion, pride etc.
    Was conditions, humidity a factor?
    Maybe we have aimed to peak for quarters and got caught out by a well coached home side.

    Leave a comment:


  • the plastic paddy
    replied
    Originally posted by Balla Boy View Post
    I don't think it's a mutually exclusive thing to admire the performance that the Japanese put in and still feel it was a terrible, terrible thing for Ireland to lose that game.

    Out-coached, out-thought, out-fought. Visibly physically unable to cope, and tactically unable to get control of the game.

    Yes, it still needed an amazing performance from Japan to capitalise on that. But it's not just a case of meeting a better team on the day. We left ourselves open for a well motivated side that should have been nowhere near us to take us. That's shocking at a World Cup, with all of the planning and resource that's been put in.
    Ireland were complacent, they got two scores up and thought they could stick their arses in the air like Paul Carbery on a good thing and cruise home on the bridle. That is not to knock Japan who were relentless and, freakishly, accurate, just to observe that Ireland got cocky.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mumhain
    replied
    Originally posted by Munsterboy View Post

    What irritates me is that so many seem to just want to have a go at individual players rather than actually look at the reasons that most of the team, and the pack in particular, didn't dominate the opposition in the second half. I guess when people are disappointed it makes them feel a bit better to get stuck in.
    What irritates me is when people imply that people being paid to do a professional job shouldn't/can't be critized for underperformance. As long as there are no personal attacks, I personally don't see any issue with people pointing out weaknesses in a player's game. We're not living under a Stalinist Soviet regime, as much as some people on here would like us to be.

    There is also a very obvious reason as to why individual mistakes are being highlighted as opposed to system errors. Personnel can be changed in a short space of time, game plans and systems, less so. There is nowhere near enough time to change the system during the next few weeks, so we're stuck with the game plan we have. When it works, it can be highly effective.

    Not sure how you can come to the conclusion "that people aren't looking at the reasons the pack didn't dominate in the second-half." There are a massive amount of posts pointing out factors as to why the pack mightn't have performed. Some of them being that the line-out didn't function because of Best's throwing, some being because of fatigue and some being because of a one-dimensional game plan that allowed Japan to commit multiple tacklers to one-out Irish carriers. You might not agree with these reasons, but you can't deny that they are being pointed out.



    Last edited by Mumhain; 30th-September-2019, 15:44.

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  • lawrence
    replied
    Originally posted by The Last Stand View Post

    Well said. Hats off to Japan but what I am
    still struggling with is that we lacked passion, urgency, pride and drive. Where was the leadership? Why were they complacent?

    Why was someone like Ryan who is supposedly Uber fit looking wreaked from early on? Were they trained too hard or perhaps trying to peak for the quarters?
    Looks to me like they are completely over trained physically.

    Joe has always had our sides mentally prepared, well rehearsed and as much as we don’t like the gameplan at times the players have it down to a T.

    But physically I think they have overdone it.

    Leave a comment:


  • The Last Stand
    replied
    Originally posted by Balla Boy View Post
    I don't think it's a mutually exclusive thing to admire the performance that the Japanese put in and still feel it was a terrible, terrible thing for Ireland to lose that game.

    Out-coached, out-thought, out-fought. Visibly physically unable to cope, and tactically unable to get control of the game.

    Yes, it still needed an amazing performance from Japan to capitalise on that. But it's not just a case of meeting a better team on the day. We left ourselves open for a well motivated side that should have been nowhere near us to take us. That's shocking at a World Cup, with all of the planning and resource that's been put in.
    Well said. Hats off to Japan but what I am
    still struggling with is that we lacked passion, urgency, pride and drive. Where was the leadership? Why were they complacent?

    Why was someone like Ryan who is supposedly Uber fit looking wreaked from early on? Were they trained too hard or perhaps trying to peak for the quarters?

    Leave a comment:


  • lawrence
    replied
    Originally posted by Talking Sense View Post
    Poor old Jack Carty, picking him in a game of this magnitude was a huge error from Joe. If Sexton cant start 2 games in a row then he should have been jettisoned months ago and Joey made first choice. Sexton needed to start this game and get us into a secure place before emptying the bench. Joe getting off very lightly around these parts IMO.
    I heard the lads on RTe today saying that he wasn’t available, which is just lazy because joe said that he decided not to pick him when the team was announced.

    Sexton should have at least been on the bench.

    Leave a comment:


  • ormond lad
    replied
    Originally posted by Talking Sense View Post
    Poor old Jack Carty, picking him in a game of this magnitude was a huge error from Joe. If Sexton cant start 2 games in a row then he should have been jettisoned months ago and Joey made first choice. Sexton needed to start this game and get us into a secure place before emptying the bench. Joe getting off very lightly around these parts IMO.
    Yeah Jettison Sexton...
    Joe is getting off fairly lightly but some of the guys in media who didnt make any criticisms at all in past are beginning to make some criticisms even though he finishes up in few weeks time

    Leave a comment:


  • Talking Sense
    replied
    Poor old Jack Carty, picking him in a game of this magnitude was a huge error from Joe. If Sexton cant start 2 games in a row then he should have been jettisoned months ago and Joey made first choice. Sexton needed to start this game and get us into a secure place before emptying the bench. Joe getting off very lightly around these parts IMO.

    Leave a comment:


  • Balla Boy
    replied

    The good news is that Samoa are even worse than Scotland, so no excuses for not taking 10 points from the next 2 games.

    Leave a comment:


  • Balla Boy
    replied
    Originally posted by Cowboy View Post
    I cannot see us going beyond the 1/4 final, the glaring things that hampered us in previous wobbles cropped up again against Chapan.

    South Africa and NZ are eminently capable of hammering up and putting us under pressure, getting in Johnnys face, and chopping CJ or Ryan/Hendo down at source. Our hooker looked ferociously tired against japan


    Our most effective centres are both concussed at this RWC already. We've issues with 10 for multiple reasons. The refs we've had are anathema to what we like to do and play.


    And yet you still have the odd person screaming and shouting, we've known these limitations for years. Its not like they just materialised overnight
    I was very surprised by our performance, or lack thereof. After Scotland, I thought he'd answered his critics and timed his run and the peaking of his players well. I'm far less sure now.

    Leave a comment:

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