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    Originally posted by In Joe we trust View Post
    The most surprising thing was the number of turnovers and handling errors by Earl's.

    Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
    I was surprised at how good CJs stats were. I thought he was Ireland’s best player in Japan but this backs that up
    "There are a lot of points that we’ve left behind and this is with a young group. That probably tells you what they’re capable of and that they’re a very good side.

    Probably next year or the year after next they will take some stopping"

    Anthony Foley, May 2016. Axel RIP

    Comment


      Originally posted by In Joe we trust View Post
      The most surprising thing was the number of turnovers and handling errors by Earl's.

      Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
      When you run the ball a million times, 8 handling errors isn't much...

      Pointingers is useless at this stage, they all played rubbish.. Your comment is laughable to be honest..
      He was as lame as a duck. Not the metaphorical lame duck either, but a real duck that was actually lame. Maybe from stepping on a land mine or something.

      Comment


        Originally posted by In Joe we trust View Post
        The most surprising thing was the number of turnovers and handling errors by Earl's.

        Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
        Originally posted by i_like_cake View Post

        When you run the ball a million times, 8 handling errors isn't much...

        Pointingers is useless at this stage, they all played rubbish.. Your comment is laughable to be honest..
        Indeed. Of course IJWT came here to tell us how badly a Munster player did - as a dog returns to his vomit, so a fool repeats his folly. The full picture is that tackle success for Earls was 76%, while Stockdale and Kearney made just 57% and 63% of their attempted tackles respectively. Those are both poor, but it's a particularly appalling stat for the man who is the last line of defence, whose place in the squad we were repeatedly told was in large part because of his defensive solidity. That's solid as in lumber, I guess ... By the way, Earls also delivered 6 offloads, twice as many as Stockdale and Ringrose. How many offloads did Kearney make? One ...

        Kearney's tackle stats came as no surprise to me, sadly, but I have to say that before the tournament started I would have expected better from Stockdale. He was fairly anonymous as an attacking threat too, and I remember thinkiing prior to the NZ game that he hadn't done enough during the pool stages to justify starting the QF ahead of Conway or Larmour.

        Another thing that surprised me is that Furlong(!) had the joint second highest number of turnovers conceded, at 6 - I really wouldn't have expected a bullock like him to have such low figures for retaining possession. On top of that, three of our regular pack featured in the least metres per carry stats - Best, Porter and Healy all made less than a metre per carry, as did Kleyn and Murphy (albeit from much less game time). Just goes to show how badly outmuscled we were up front.
        Tis but a scratch.

        Comment


          Originally posted by mr chips View Post


          Indeed. Of course IJWT came here to tell us how badly a Munster player did - as a dog returns to his vomit, so a fool repeats his folly. The full picture is that tackle success for Earls was 76%, while Stockdale and Kearney made just 57% and 63% of their attempted tackles respectively. Those are both poor, but it's a particularly appalling stat for the man who is the last line of defence, whose place in the squad we were repeatedly told was in large part because of his defensive solidity. That's solid as in lumber, I guess ... By the way, Earls also delivered 6 offloads, twice as many as Stockdale and Ringrose. How many offloads did Kearney make? One ...

          Kearney's tackle stats came as no surprise to me, sadly, but I have to say that before the tournament started I would have expected better from Stockdale. He was fairly anonymous as an attacking threat too, and I remember thinkiing prior to the NZ game that he hadn't done enough during the pool stages to justify starting the QF ahead of Conway or Larmour.

          Another thing that surprised me is that Furlong(!) had the joint second highest number of turnovers conceded, at 6 - I really wouldn't have expected a bullock like him to have such low figures for retaining possession. On top of that, three of our regular pack featured in the least metres per carry stats - Best, Porter and Healy all made less than a metre per carry, as did Kleyn and Murphy (albeit from much less game time). Just goes to show how badly outmuscled we were up front.
          I made a comment that the most surprising stat was the number of errors as it didn't seem like it - nothing to do with slating Earl's.

          From an attacking perspective would you like -
          6 line breaks from 17 carries
          6 line breaks from 42 carries
          5 line breaks from 18 carries
          4 line breaks from 28 carries

          Comment


            Using my eyes, rather than stats:

            Earls was ok. Solid defence and he made a few telling contributions (the Japan try saver, the regather and offload for Conway’s BP try against Russia, his offload for Ringrose’s try against Russia) but the ball didn’t come his way very much. He’s an excellent player in pretty good form, but he was a bit wasted in Joe’s system.

            Stockdale was poor. A young talented player struggling with confidence. He’ll be back.

            Rob was poor. An old once-talented player struggling with being a bit ****e now. He’ll be dropped.

            Larmour was good and getting better with each game.

            Conway was flying around the place.

            Back three for NZ should have been Earls, Conway, Larmour, but it probably wouldn’t have mattered.


            Comment


              Originally posted by mr chips View Post
              Another thing that surprised me is that Furlong(!) had the joint second highest number of turnovers conceded, at 6 - I really wouldn't have expected a bullock like him to have such low figures for retaining possession.
              He had 3 missed tackles against NZ as well, not sure what's going on with him but he hasn't looked himself in the last few months.

              Comment


                Originally posted by mr chips View Post


                Indeed. Of course IJWT came here to tell us how badly a Munster player did - as a dog returns to his vomit, so a fool repeats his folly. The full picture is that tackle success for Earls was 76%, while Stockdale and Kearney made just 57% and 63% of their attempted tackles respectively. Those are both poor, but it's a particularly appalling stat for the man who is the last line of defence, whose place in the squad we were repeatedly told was in large part because of his defensive solidity. That's solid as in lumber, I guess ... By the way, Earls also delivered 6 offloads, twice as many as Stockdale and Ringrose. How many offloads did Kearney make? One ...

                Kearney's tackle stats came as no surprise to me, sadly, but I have to say that before the tournament started I would have expected better from Stockdale. He was fairly anonymous as an attacking threat too, and I remember thinkiing prior to the NZ game that he hadn't done enough during the pool stages to justify starting the QF ahead of Conway or Larmour.

                Another thing that surprised me is that Furlong(!) had the joint second highest number of turnovers conceded, at 6 - I really wouldn't have expected a bullock like him to have such low figures for retaining possession. On top of that, three of our regular pack featured in the least metres per carry stats - Best, Porter and Healy all made less than a metre per carry, as did Kleyn and Murphy (albeit from much less game time). Just goes to show how badly outmuscled we were up front.
                Metre per carry stats are always going to be bad if you're running into mobs of opposition from a standing start. I heard Barry Murphy comment on a podcast that he saw Irish players sprint five metres so that they could stop and receive a pass in a static position with three Japanese players lining them up. As for Stockdale, either he just doesn't understand defence or he isn't been taught it - he's too good an attacking threat to just discard. Neither Stockdale nor Earls scored a try in the WC but that isn't that much of a reflection on them, I've been that winger on teams where the ball doesn't come your way and then some pr1ck has the audacity to tell you that you were 'quiet.'

                We brought nothing new to this world cup and we haven't brought something new to a world cup since the 90s. Since 2000 our success has stifled us, instead of bringing a new gameplan to 2003, 2007, 2011, 2015 and 2019 we tried to recreate something that had happened a year or two before those world cups. We value experience far too highly and generally avoid dropping 'legends.' We are often undone in the WC by teams who do not impress during 6 nations or Autumn internationals but repackage themselves and bring an 'A game' to a WC. I'd be confident of us easily beating Argentina, Japan and Fiji in one-off internationals but all of those teams would fancy their chances against us in the WC whereas we'd enter the contest burdened by hubris and blinded by the apparent inadequacies of the opposition.
                2011 was a brilliant example, we knew nothing about Wales - WArburton was a really young captain and nobody knew a lot about George North or Alex Cuthbert. When the crunch came we went for tried and tested, only problem was GAtland knew exactly what our 'tried and tested' was and my abiding memory of that match was Ferris and O'Brien being tackled very low by backrows I knew little about and the unknown back-three covering all of ROG's attempted kicks to the corner.

                This world cup was the worst, we tried to reproduce a distilled, no frills version of what we thought worked for us in 2016-2018 whereas the rest of the tournament brought something new.

                Just to save ourselves the pain, let's avoid calling any Ireland player a 'legend' until they actually preform in the WC quarter-final.

                Comment


                  Originally posted by Munsterboy View Post
                  Using my eyes, rather than stats:

                  Earls was ok. Solid defence and he made a few telling contributions (the Japan try saver, the regather and offload for Conway’s BP try against Russia, his offload for Ringrose’s try against Russia) but the ball didn’t come his way very much. He’s an excellent player in pretty good form, but he was a bit wasted in Joe’s system.

                  Stockdale was poor. A young talented player struggling with confidence. He’ll be back.

                  Rob was poor. An old once-talented player struggling with being a bit ****e now. He’ll be dropped.

                  Larmour was good and getting better with each game.

                  Conway was flying around the place.

                  Back three for NZ should have been Earls, Conway, Larmour, but it probably wouldn’t have mattered.

                  Don’t be so sure, centrally contracted players have an amazing habit of being included in match day squads.

                  how he got another year is really just a sick joke.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Brenny View Post
                    ...
                    We brought nothing new to this world cup and we haven't brought something new to a world cup since the 90s. Since 2000 our success has stifled us, instead of bringing a new gameplan to 2003, 2007, 2011, 2015 and 2019 we tried to recreate something that had happened a year or two before those world cups. We value experience far too highly and generally avoid dropping 'legends.' We are often undone in the WC by teams who do not impress during 6 nations or Autumn internationals but repackage themselves and bring an 'A game' to a WC. I'd be confident of us easily beating Argentina, Japan and Fiji in one-off internationals but all of those teams would fancy their chances against us in the WC whereas we'd enter the contest burdened by hubris and blinded by the apparent inadequacies of the opposition.
                    2011 was a brilliant example, we knew nothing about Wales - WArburton was a really young captain and nobody knew a lot about George North or Alex Cuthbert. When the crunch came we went for tried and tested, only problem was GAtland knew exactly what our 'tried and tested' was and my abiding memory of that match was Ferris and O'Brien being tackled very low by backrows I knew little about and the unknown back-three covering all of ROG's attempted kicks to the corner.

                    This world cup was the worst, we tried to reproduce a distilled, no frills version of what we thought worked for us in 2016-2018 whereas the rest of the tournament brought something new.

                    Just to save ourselves the pain, let's avoid calling any Ireland player a 'legend' until they actually preform in the WC quarter-final.
                    This. And I'd add once more that I'm sick of watching absolutely jaded, overplayed Irish teams flop in RWC quarter finals cos of lack of recovery and squad rotation. EOS did this repeatedly, it happened at the last RWC cos of the draw apparently, but this RWC there was no valid reason, just a coach caught by Japan, and then panicking & so unnecessarily playing his top side v Samoa, just 7 days before being annihilated by the ABs. Compound that with picking over the hill players, using out moded game plans and not rewarding form (e.g. Larmour, Conway, etc) and what you got was really bad player and squad management by Ireland @RWC19. And this really showed in the pitifully poor performances on the pitch.

                    ____________________________________________
                    Munster were great when they were Munster.

                    alas they are just north munster now.......
                    ____________________________________________

                    Comment


                      Why is IJWT's blatant trolling tolerated here?
                      Yorn desh born, der ritt de gitt der gue,
                      Orn desh, dee born desh, de umn bork! bork! bork!

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Daithi View Post

                        This. And I'd add once more that I'm sick of watching absolutely jaded, overplayed Irish teams flop in RWC quarter finals cos of lack of recovery and squad rotation. EOS did this repeatedly, it happened at the last RWC cos of the draw apparently, but this RWC there was no valid reason, just a coach caught by Japan, and then panicking & so unnecessarily playing his top side v Samoa, just 7 days before being annihilated by the ABs. Compound that with picking over the hill players, using out moded game plans and not rewarding form (e.g. Larmour, Conway, etc) and what you got was really bad player and squad management by Ireland @RWC19. And this really showed in the pitifully poor performances on the pitch.
                        Amazing how Welsh team of Jones, Owens, Francis, AWJ, Ball, Wainright, Tipuric, Navidi, Davies, Biggar, Adams, Parkes, Davies, North, Williams were all able to start and play three games in a row (Georgia, Australia, Fiji) and yet the Irish guys are unable to play two games in a row according to your logic?

                        So which gameplan should Ireland have adopted - The SA game plan which got them to a final (but lost to NZ), the NZ gameplan (which got smashed by England), the Welsh game plan (which luckily got them to a semi-final)??

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by In Joe we trust View Post

                          Amazing how Welsh team of Jones, Owens, Francis, AWJ, Ball, Wainright, Tipuric, Navidi, Davies, Biggar, Adams, Parkes, Davies, North, Williams were all able to start and play three games in a row (Georgia, Australia, Fiji) and yet the Irish guys are unable to play two games in a row according to your logic?

                          So which gameplan should Ireland have adopted - The SA game plan which got them to a final (but lost to NZ), the NZ gameplan (which got smashed by England), the Welsh game plan (which luckily got them to a semi-final)??

                          But the question is, were they at 100%. It's highly unlikely.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by In Joe we trust View Post

                            Amazing how Welsh team of Jones, Owens, Francis, AWJ, Ball, Wainright, Tipuric, Navidi, Davies, Biggar, Adams, Parkes, Davies, North, Williams were all able to start and play three games in a row (Georgia, Australia, Fiji) and yet the Irish guys are unable to play two games in a row according to your logic?

                            So which gameplan should Ireland have adopted - The SA game plan which got them to a final (but lost to NZ), the NZ gameplan (which got smashed by England), the Welsh game plan (which luckily got them to a semi-final)??
                            ****e coaching, innit?
                            I am the million man.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by In Joe we trust View Post

                              Amazing how Welsh team of Jones, Owens, Francis, AWJ, Ball, Wainright, Tipuric, Navidi, Davies, Biggar, Adams, Parkes, Davies, North, Williams were all able to start and play three games in a row (Georgia, Australia, Fiji) and yet the Irish guys are unable to play two games in a row according to your logic?

                              So which gameplan should Ireland have adopted - The SA game plan which got them to a final (but lost to NZ), the NZ gameplan (which got smashed by England), the Welsh game plan (which luckily got them to a semi-final)??
                              Ireland visibly struggled to recover within a week of playing well v Scotland, & this contributed to them being flat, playing poorly& losing v Japan.

                              Yet, the coach felt that they could recover fully in 7 days after playing Samoa, 2 weeks later with even more accumulated fatigue. This was especially frustrating when he knew NZ had a full 14 days of rest & prep before playing Ireland. Even if he selectively rotated a few key positions & units e.g. front row, a 2nd row, the back row & half backs , this would have gone a very long way towards producing a far fresher Irish side v NZ, who would have played much better imho.

                              Wrt game plans, would it really have been asking too much that Ireland at least got away from one out carries by this RWC!? Instead, Nz were able to too easily identify & line up Irish one out ball carriers from the off, &were able to dispossess them on demand (e g. Healy, Henshaw, etc, etc) by double tacking them, which really disrupted Ireland.

                              Also, selection policy was rubbish. Kearney & Best were past it. Other better players in better form were left out (or at home) (Conway, Larmour, Farrell, Marmion, etc) for players in visibly poorer form who were selected. Joe Schmidt's Ireland were asking for another big beating ( after England twice, Wales & Japan had already done so in 2019) , and they duly got it in the RWC QF, mainly cos they were crap....
                              Last edited by Daithi; 30th-October-2019, 22:09.
                              ____________________________________________
                              Munster were great when they were Munster.

                              alas they are just north munster now.......
                              ____________________________________________

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Piquet View Post
                                It would appear to be all Stuart Lancaster's fault, according to BOD.
                                Did Leinster win too many trophies??? BOD is an idiot.

                                Comment

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