Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

RWC 2019 31 Man squad

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Anyway... apparently we didn't put in a single box kick on Saturday. Can't say I was paying particular attention so don't know if it's true but it'd make sense.

    Comment


      Originally posted by LongtimeLurker View Post


      Sidebar argument & not wumming as whoever selected is going to hold tackle bags primarily but who has not been given a chance / who should be there instead of him?

      When I checked realised Schmidt gave Conway his debut after the last world cup, I thought he had made his debut in a friendly prior to the 2015 world cup. Stockdale, Larmour and Conway are back three players Schmidt has capped & brought through, at least two of them will travel.

      In fairness to Schmidt & Co since the last world cup apart from the three above they have also given debuts in the back three to O’Halloran, Healy, Adeolokun, Sweetnam, Byrne, Addison, Arnold and now Haley. Some real talent there that has for whatever reason not made the leap. Gilroy has played for Schmidt a number of times I am sure there are others currently outside the squad I am forgetting too, barring injury Jared Payne might have still been in the mix. Wooton did not make the jump to representative XVs from sevens, this world cup has just come around too soon for the likes of Balocoune.

      I don’t think you can argue that someone deserving has not been looked at or given an opportunity – whether they have taken it in the eyes of the coaching team is another question. O’Halloran possibly the biggest disappointment but for whatever reason his face doesn’t seem to fit. I know Kearney bashing is the unofficial second sport here but genuinely think it’s a case that they have gone back to a player they rate ahead of other players they have looked at.

      I'll get my coat.

      I think that’s a fair post- the brothers play the Schmidt game- and have done for a decade or more. It’s very hard for someone who doesn’t to show in an occasional game that they can do it, and offer more. Players of far greater ability have been cast aside in favour of cogs that fit the Schmidt machine. I am not convinced that given sufficient opportunity others wouldn’t have surpassed both- but it’s not going to happen now. Says a great deal for earls and stockdale that they are first choice despite not having gone to the Schmidt primary school

      Comment


        Originally posted by whimpersnap View Post
        Anyway... apparently we didn't put in a single box kick on Saturday. Can't say I was paying particular attention so don't know if it's true but it'd make sense.
        Is that what we are holding back for japan so? Box kicking? Nobody will suspect a thing.

        Comment


          Originally posted by lawrence View Post

          Is that what we are holding back for japan so? Box kicking? Nobody will suspect a thing.
          Its hard to setup with numbers to defend the cross field kick as well as the box kick and still rush up with bodies in midfield though.

          Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

          Comment


            Good article on the kicking game here. https://www.the42.ie/analysis-ireland-k ... 4-Aug2019/


            That's the main thing I took from the game. They really varied the kicks and looked to exploit space rather than the preprogrammed box kick from the 9.


            Schmidt will be looking to mix the game up more or at least have the threat of doing so and keep the opposition defenders stretched. We saw at the weekend what you might call plan B.


            These new kicks will help open up defences. The (ROG's!) crusaders were doing it all season and if teams went to defend their variety of kicks it usually left space somewhere else. It manipulates the defence. I liked the kicking from deep. Why clear it to touch if you can get a winger like Conway up against another winger.


            The Italians had to adapt to it which leaves their defence weak somewhere else.


            Though it wasn't the greatest game I don't think the team was going out to win by as much as possible and JS will be happy with how it went. EOS might disagree but he was only looking at the game and not the big picture.


            One other big benefit of that gameplan is it's not very attritional. The last group game is against Samoa and the last thing they need going into that is a war of attrition. If they played mainly this type of kicking game then there would be a lot fewer big collisions and there would be more stoppages which means less ball in play time. Obviously Carbery got injured but that was a bit freakish.


            The 6N was poor but it shows the benefits of playing against quality opposition. They'll expose any weakness. They've done us a favour in that regard.

            Comment


              Conway’s catching was excellent, I remember two great takes he had that set up nice attacks.

              The less said about Daverages ability to pick up a ball and fall over the try line the better. He butchered a clear chance

              Comment


                Originally posted by dropkick View Post
                Good article on the kicking game here. https://www.the42.ie/analysis-ireland-k ... 4-Aug2019/


                That's the main thing I took from the game. They really varied the kicks and looked to exploit space rather than the preprogrammed box kick from the 9.


                Schmidt will be looking to mix the game up more or at least have the threat of doing so and keep the opposition defenders stretched. We saw at the weekend what you might call plan B.


                These new kicks will help open up defences. The (ROG's!) crusaders were doing it all season and if teams went to defend their variety of kicks it usually left space somewhere else. It manipulates the defence. I liked the kicking from deep. Why clear it to touch if you can get a winger like Conway up against another winger.


                The Italians had to adapt to it which leaves their defence weak somewhere else.


                Though it wasn't the greatest game I don't think the team was going out to win by as much as possible and JS will be happy with how it went. EOS might disagree but he was only looking at the game and not the big picture.


                One other big benefit of that gameplan is it's not very attritional. The last group game is against Samoa and the last thing they need going into that is a war of attrition. If they played mainly this type of kicking game then there would be a lot fewer big collisions and there would be more stoppages which means less ball in play time. Obviously Carbery got injured but that was a bit freakish.


                The 6N was poor but it shows the benefits of playing against quality opposition. They'll expose any weakness. They've done us a favour in that regard.
                Good article- thanks for posting. It’s a style that would really suit Carty- who’s ball from hand kick is excellent- but obvious execution both of the kick and chase is critical. With base of ruck etc from Murray, will cause a lot of difficulty for depth of defensive line, and that may create more space. Get it wrong, though, and we will leak tries. Given how shrewd/ conservative Schmidt is, I suppose this plan a.1 is as close as we’ll get to a plan b.

                Comment


                  Originally posted by Munsterboy View Post

                  O’Halloran is top of the list of lads who really didn’t get a proper go. Got injured very early on his debut and given very short shrift since. He’s miles better than Kearney, and it’s not just his highlights reel, he’s a quality player.

                  Adeolokun and Healy have their flaws but they’ll score you tries, Healy especially. Kearney won’t, and his defence, when faced with quick elusive runners, isn’t exactly bulletproof (as Argentina showed at the last RWC).
                  O'Halloran went on the summer tours to South Africa in 2016 and USA/Japan in 2017 (2 starts, 3 sub apps) plus he was involved in the Autumn squad in 2016, starting against Canada. Schmidt clearly had a look at him in this time frame and wasn't impressed enough to cap him since.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by dropkick View Post
                    Good article on the kicking game here. https://www.the42.ie/analysis-ireland-k ... 4-Aug2019/


                    That's the main thing I took from the game. They really varied the kicks and looked to exploit space rather than the preprogrammed box kick from the 9.


                    Schmidt will be looking to mix the game up more or at least have the threat of doing so and keep the opposition defenders stretched. We saw at the weekend what you might call plan B.


                    These new kicks will help open up defences. The (ROG's!) crusaders were doing it all season and if teams went to defend their variety of kicks it usually left space somewhere else. It manipulates the defence. I liked the kicking from deep. Why clear it to touch if you can get a winger like Conway up against another winger.


                    The Italians had to adapt to it which leaves their defence weak somewhere else.


                    Though it wasn't the greatest game I don't think the team was going out to win by as much as possible and JS will be happy with how it went. EOS might disagree but he was only looking at the game and not the big picture.


                    One other big benefit of that gameplan is it's not very attritional. The last group game is against Samoa and the last thing they need going into that is a war of attrition. If they played mainly this type of kicking game then there would be a lot fewer big collisions and there would be more stoppages which means less ball in play time. Obviously Carbery got injured but that was a bit freakish.


                    The 6N was poor but it shows the benefits of playing against quality opposition. They'll expose any weakness. They've done us a favour in that regard.
                    I have no issue with grubber kicks in behind defenses but those cross field kicks inside our own 22 are high risk... I'm surprised a coach as risk adverse as Schmidt would even contemplate using them. If used against quality opposition, they'll backfire.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by kahalui View Post

                      I have no issue with grubber kicks in behind defenses but those cross field kicks inside our own 22 are high risk... I'm surprised a coach as risk adverse as Schmidt would even contemplate using them. If used against quality opposition, they'll backfire.

                      No harm doing it an odd time. The biggest problem with Ireland was predictability. Everyone knew what was coming so could put more defenders in that area. By having more variety you're going stretch defences more which allows the likes of Stander that extra bit of space to carry.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by dropkick View Post


                        No harm doing it an odd time. The biggest problem with Ireland was predictability. Everyone knew what was coming so could put more defenders in that area. By having more variety you're going stretch defences more which allows the likes of Stander that extra bit of space to carry.
                        If there's a big overlap outside or If advantage is being played, cross field kicks from inside the 22 may work out. Otherwise, you're asking for trouble.

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by kahalui View Post

                          I have no issue with grubber kicks in behind defenses but those cross field kicks inside our own 22 are high risk... I'm surprised a coach as risk adverse as Schmidt would even contemplate using them. If used against quality opposition, they'll backfire.
                          You need to look at the longer pattern. Schmidt has a developed a system where we consistently play in between the tramlines and retain possession. Other coaches have seen this and have narrowed their defense knowing that we don't go wide fast. The use of crossfield kicks through this series to players like Conway, Earls and Kearney who rel all good in the air will give the other teams analysts something to think about and will put question marks in what defensive set up to use against us. The top 10 sides can all execute an agreed gameplan well, the difference between this and the winners of the RWC will be who is able to adjust their gameplan on the field.

                          If a team sets up to defend us narrowly down the middle and we kick wide it will make them begin to question their system That kind of doubt and adjustment can be exploited. If they set up wide to prevent the kicks we can adjust and play down the middle with more space then we have had for the past 12 months.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by dropkick View Post


                            No harm doing it an odd time. The biggest problem with Ireland was predictability. Everyone knew what was coming so could put more defenders in that area. By having more variety you're going stretch defences more which allows the likes of Stander that extra bit of space to carry.
                            Interesting that Ireland are adopting this tactic now. In 2018, when Ireland were at their relative best, they often feigned a box kick set up and then ran from their 22 (maybe after 1 quick ruck), and this paid huge dividends v NZ, England, Wales, Aus & other quality sides (& quality defences).

                            By adding this 3rd type of option, using things like cross kicks, & grubbers,etc to get behind defences and regather ahead of set back back3s , is now yet another string to Ireland's bow of exit plays and by having a variety of types of such plays available (e.g. box kicks, run wide from deep plays, and, grubber/cross kick plays,etc,etc) this should help stretch & stress defences more , in potentially many different ways, and keep them guessing.

                            Here's hoping, good work from Ireland regardless!!
                            Last edited by Daithi; 13th-August-2019, 10:44.
                            ____________________________________________
                            Munster were great when they were Munster.

                            alas they are just north munster now.......
                            ____________________________________________

                            Comment


                              We have badly needed to add width to our attack also, we have typically been attacking exclusively inside the 5meter lines.

                              It also open the opportunity of stockdale or Earls coming onto a cross field kick. Stockdale in particular who is lethal in such situations

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by AwayFromHome View Post

                                You need to look at the longer pattern. Schmidt has a developed a system where we consistently play in between the tramlines and retain possession. Other coaches have seen this and have narrowed their defense knowing that we don't go wide fast. The use of crossfield kicks through this series to players like Conway, Earls and Kearney who rel all good in the air will give the other teams analysts something to think about and will put question marks in what defensive set up to use against us. The top 10 sides can all execute an agreed gameplan well, the difference between this and the winners of the RWC will be who is able to adjust their gameplan on the field.

                                If a team sets up to defend us narrowly down the middle and we kick wide it will make them begin to question their system That kind of doubt and adjustment can be exploited. If they set up wide to prevent the kicks we can adjust and play down the middle with more space then we have had for the past 12 months.
                                I've taken all of that into account. I can understand the logic behind using them but I don't think they'll bring about the desired result.
                                A quickly executed, low-flying cross field kick may work if we have more numbers out wide.
                                Carberrys cross field kicking at the weekend was more 'garryowen' like which gives the defense plenty of time to adjust and negate any perceived advantage.

                                I guess we'll see what happens over the coming weeks, if Ire continue to use them from inside their 22.
                                Last edited by kahalui; 13th-August-2019, 11:03.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X