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    #61
    Originally posted by Miguel Sanchez View Post
    Had they done nothing wrong the IRFU wouldn't have had any grounds to fire them.
    They were paid out of their contracts, not fired.
    Commemorate Nevin Spence here -
    http://www.mycharity.ie/event/munste..._nevin_spence/

    Comment


      #62
      Originally posted by Jackie Brown View Post

      They were paid out of their contracts, not fired.
      Whether they were paid off or not isn't important Jackie.

      The point is their services were no longer required.

      Yorn desh born, der ritt de gitt der gue,
      Orn desh, dee born desh, de umn bork! bork! bork!

      Comment


        #63
        Originally posted by Jackie Brown View Post

        Benny you know as well as I do that he didn't actually say anything offensive on those WhatsApp messages. The worst stuff was said by a failed academy player who was also on trial and by a guy was still plays for Ulster....
        One second now. P.J. was found not guilty on all charges and (according to you) didn't say anything offensive on WhatsApp.

        What did he do wrong in that case sufficient to have his contract terminated?

        ​​​​​



        Yorn desh born, der ritt de gitt der gue,
        Orn desh, dee born desh, de umn bork! bork! bork!

        Comment


          #64
          Originally posted by Miguel Sanchez View Post

          One second now. P.J. was found not guilty on all charges and (according to you) didn't say anything offensive on WhatsApp.

          What did he do wrong in that case sufficient to have his contract terminated?

          ​​​​​


          An interesting one, he was also supposedly bringing lawsuits against folks after the case.

          Don't recall those materialising. Look, they obviously had clauses in their contracts that allowed the union to move them on. Paid, Fired, whatever way you slice it, the union wanted shot of them.

          Comment


            #65
            Agreed.

            The fact that it's now giving sponsors reason to reconsider only goes to highlight this.
            Yorn desh born, der ritt de gitt der gue,
            Orn desh, dee born desh, de umn bork! bork! bork!

            Comment


              #66
              They weren't sacked or fired. They got paid off by the IRFU because they were toxic to the brand thanks to the online witch hunt that is still ongoing. There is a big difference there. The IRFU couldn't sack them for not committing a crime.

              I'm not really sure what will make the twitter looneys happy, it looks like torture and death will be the only way to appease them. They were hounded out of their jobs and country thanks to false accusations. Sad state of affairs all round.

              I don't think Diageo or going to jump ship with LI and I don't think LI will pay off Paddy's freshly signed contract. I expect something to be put in place to offer PJ a road to redemption, education, working with vulnerable groups or some such. Something the IRFU should have done rather than throw them to the wolves.
              Commemorate Nevin Spence here -
              http://www.mycharity.ie/event/munste..._nevin_spence/

              Comment


                #67
                https://www.irishtimes.com/news/irel...ding-1.3461283

                What's the difference between having a "contract revoked" as per the I.T. and being fired?



                Yorn desh born, der ritt de gitt der gue,
                Orn desh, dee born desh, de umn bork! bork! bork!

                Comment


                  #68
                  https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/uk-nort...eland-43766959

                  "Contracts terminated".

                  Jackson's comments are also quite telling.
                  Yorn desh born, der ritt de gitt der gue,
                  Orn desh, dee born desh, de umn bork! bork! bork!

                  Comment


                    #69
                    Probably the size of the payoff.
                    Commemorate Nevin Spence here -
                    http://www.mycharity.ie/event/munste..._nevin_spence/

                    Comment


                      #70
                      Originally posted by Jackie Brown View Post

                      Benny you know as well as I do that he didn't actually say anything offensive on those WhatsApp messages.
                      Even Paddy admits he made offensive comments on the Whatsapp chat. Here are his own words, a few weeks after the acquittal:

                      Mr Jackson said public criticism of his behaviour was "fully justified" and he expressed determination to return to the values and principles that guided his upbringing, in particular the importance of respect.
                      He said: "I am also truly sorry for engaging in a Whatsapp group chat which was degrading and offensive and I apologise unreservedly for this.
                      "The criticism of my behaviour is fully justified and I know I have betrayed the values of my family and those of the wider public.
                      "Following the trial I have taken time to reflect with my family on the values that were such an integral part of my upbringing, the most important of which is respect.
                      "My departure from these values has caused understandable public anger and I am resolutely committed to returning to those principles."
                      Tis but a scratch.

                      Comment


                        #71
                        Originally posted by Jackie Brown View Post
                        Probably the size of the payoff.
                        I'm not sure it makes much difference tbh. They were told by the IRFU that their services were no longer required. That doesn't just happen for no reason.
                        Yorn desh born, der ritt de gitt der gue,
                        Orn desh, dee born desh, de umn bork! bork! bork!

                        Comment


                          #72
                          Originally posted by mr chips View Post

                          Even Paddy admits he made offensive comments on the Whatsapp chat. Here are his own words, a few weeks after the acquittal:
                          Reads like an attempt to be humble, which is entirely appropriate. Wouldn't have done much good to come out and just give the fingers saying, "all I wrote was, there was a lot of spit" then exit stage right. The mob had made up their mind and he was on damage limitation.

                          How much vitriol online and harrassing of employers is enough?
                          When do the mob decide he's had enough punishment for sending that message?
                          Why isn't the girl being harrassed for referring to the other female attendees as 'sluts' or making jokes about fake rape claims with her mates?
                          What about the one independent eyewitness who
                          disagreed with the girl's version of events?
                          All conveniently forgotten by the ill informed online mob.

                          It's a really sad reflection of modern society. A real life black mirror episode.

                          Anyway, I hope LI tell Diageo that a company selling the most damaging drug in human society should maybe be looking a bit closer to home before spouting moral guidance.
                          Commemorate Nevin Spence here -
                          http://www.mycharity.ie/event/munste..._nevin_spence/

                          Comment


                            #73
                            Originally posted by Miguel Sanchez View Post

                            I'm not sure it makes much difference tbh. They were told by the IRFU that their services were no longer required. That doesn't just happen for no reason.
                            It doesn't but as I said, there is a difference to being sacked and being paid out of your contract. It's small inaccuracies like that which the baying mob feed off.
                            Commemorate Nevin Spence here -
                            http://www.mycharity.ie/event/munste..._nevin_spence/

                            Comment


                              #74
                              Originally posted by Miguel Sanchez View Post
                              Whilst Jackson was found not guilty of rape and sexual assault he was a party to those messages on Whatsapp.

                              Now you could argue that the nature of one of those chats is private, but that's no longer the case in this instance. His behavior was sufficiently poor to warrant the cancellation of his IRFU contract, and it's this that is causing Guinness to reconsider it's sponsorship of the Not Nots. Frankly I think they are correct to do so.
                              Funny how Gilroy was guilty of being in the same chat sending messages of a similar nature and got banned for a few weeks (an appropriate sanction for such an action with no previous). Make no mistake about it, Paddy is being treated as it he had been found guilty because the court of public opinion already decided he was long before the jury gave its verdict. That’s why there wasn’t a stream of people asking for directions to Ravenhill to protest Gilroy not being sacked.
                              “One, Fineen needs to be louder, angrier, and have access to a time machine. Two, whenever Fineen’s not on field, all the other players should be asking 'Where's Fineen?

                              Comment


                                #75
                                Originally posted by Joe Konys barmy army View Post

                                Funny how Gilroy was guilty of being in the same chat sending messages of a similar nature and got banned for a few weeks (an appropriate sanction for such an action with no previous). Make no mistake about it, Paddy is being treated as it he had been found guilty because the court of public opinion already decided he was long before the jury gave its verdict. That’s why there wasn’t a stream of people asking for directions to Ravenhill to protest Gilroy not being sacked.
                                I think it was a combination of things - Gilroy wasn't out on a 3-day drinking binge like the other lads.

                                The court of public opinion is very powerful and the IRFU would be watching their brand very carefully. I read last week where that Rugby is the most attractive sponsorship option in Ireland at the moment (presumably ahead of the GAA because of its international dimension). Whatever way you look at it, PJ & Olding brought an unwelcome spotlight onto the IRFU.

                                Jackie can rant on about the unfairness of the whole thing, but I seem to recall that the woman involved with two Munster players (all consensual and no court cases involved) left the country voluntarily/transferred by the company she was working for. Can anyone explain why she / her employers felt that it was best if she left?

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