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The Future of the Heineken Cup In Doubt?

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    Originally posted by Owain View Post
    I'm not against a B&I league, as long is it is union controlled. That may well find acceptance with the IRFU, SRU, WRU, possibly the RFU. But not with PRL who will insist on having control on any league they are in, and also negotiating any TV rights. Which PRL will argue they are entitled to do, as outlined in their 2007 PA with the English RFU. I'm not arguing against it, merely pointing out the issues with PRL.
    I don't see how it can be union controlled to be honest. There would be 18 small independent businesses and 2 unions at the table.
    The best we could hope for is union recognition with a share holding reflection our teams(4 shares in our case), exemptions from the salary cap in recognition of our self imposed cap on niq players, guarantees in writing that international windows and training camps would be recognised, a financial split representative of our participation and hopefully a gran final rotating between the 4 national stadiums.

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      For starters, 12+4=16...
      Ceterum censeo INM irrumandum esse.

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        Originally posted by exiled to connacht View Post
        The sky contract doesn't affect them so therefore it doesn't exist as far as their concerned. AFAIK its a contract signed by the unions so its the wru and Rfu s concern.

        The only time prl will acknowledge it is when its the only obstacle left to the RCC and maybe not even then as that would mean some financial loss to them.
        Consequently, it is not going to happen because it would mean a huge lawsuit against the Unions by Sky. So the only ones excluded are the English, by their own doing.

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          Originally posted by exiled to connacht View Post
          The RCC may be a dead duck but unfortunately so is the ERC. At best we will have a FIRA or 6ns cup to play for.
          What planet have you been on for the last 3 months ? !!! You can call the ERC what you want, but a Union run Heineken Cup is the only show in town, and is very much alive. The only ones excluded from that are the English. The French clubs have signed up until 2018 and if the RRW want to commit suicide, then some form of Welsh Union run clubs may take their place, but there will be a HC next season.

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            Originally posted by Thomond78 View Post
            Sometimes, Point, it's better just to give in and mix the metaphor. And this is me saying that. ;)
            Get off the stage, "The RCC is a dead duck, stillborn in the egg.", not even Eddie could come up with a class metaphor like that ! :)

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              Originally posted by Point View Post
              What planet have you been on for the last 3 months ? !!! You can call the ERC what you want, but a Union run Heineken Cup is the only show in town, and is very much alive. The only ones excluded from that are the English. The French clubs have signed up until 2018 and if the RRW want to commit suicide then some for of Welsh Union run clubs may take their place, but there will be a HC next season.
              french participation is, at the very best, unknown at this stage. and seeing as camou stormed out of the mid december meeting, i'd said it's more than at risk. racing have said they categorically will not take part without the english. it has been rumoured toulouse are similarly positioned.

              i reckon the "6n governance" euro cup excluding the french is more likely at this stage. providing they can pay off sky.

              or none at all.

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                Originally posted by PEATB0G View Post
                I spoke to a high ranking Munster official after the Connacht game and he reckons it all going to end up with a two tier B&I league. Paraphrasing here but 'with TV rights for the new league etc it would be the only way to keep up with the French.'
                very encouraging. hopefully they are pushing for it, not waiting for it.

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                  Originally posted by Thomond78 View Post
                  For starters, 12+4=16...
                  12 + 4 ?

                  We were discussing a 2 tier B+I league. I was assuming that meant 2 divisions of 12. Maybe I'm wrong.

                  Point - the French haven't officially confirmed anything yet. FFR want a FIRA controlled competition and apparently we are against that. LNR meanwhile are as quiet as PRL. I think I preferred it when they were in media every day.

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                    Originally posted by Point View Post
                    The RCC is a dead duck, stillborn in the egg.
                    Best sentence of the year

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                      i assume this article was already posted? (Date: December 19th)

                      the rugby paper

                      The English are unhappy with the way Camou blocked the Six Nations taking over the governance of the Heineken Cup, and the RFU’s chief executive, Ian Ritchie, pointed the finger at the French for playing fast and loose with something that offered a chance to break the stalemate.
                      “We should all bust a gut to get there because failure would not be a good number,” Ritchie said. “We had reached an understanding last month that the Six Nations committee would operate the tournament, with clear roles for Unions and clubs, but the only one not to sign up for it was the French Federation.
                      “Unfortunately, the French have always been reticent about the Six Nations committee because of their own association with FIRA, and they wanted a new company to be formed to run the tournament.”

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                        Simon Thomas on twitter:

                        @simonrug: Just had a good chat with Gerry Thornley of the Irish Times. What a top man. Interesting to hear his thoughts on Welsh rugby's crisis.

                        @simonrug: Doubts whether the IRFU would back the Rugby Champions Cup as its now proposed.
                        Cé go bhfuil an namhaid trampled underfoot mo thír, fhios ag an teanga d'aois na Breataine Bige aon Retreat. Evan James 1856

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                          Originally posted by Owain View Post
                          Simon Thomas on twitter:

                          @simonrug: Just had a good chat with Gerry Thornley of the Irish Times. What a top man. Interesting to hear his thoughts on Welsh rugby's crisis.

                          @simonrug: Doubts whether the IRFU would back the Rugby Champions Cup as its now proposed.
                          with the french position unclear, their options might be...

                          RCC under 6 nations governance (with or without france)

                          or

                          nothing
                          Last edited by hellovating; 2nd-January-2014, 14:55.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by hellovating View Post
                            french participation is, at the very best, unknown at this stage. and seeing as camou stormed out of the mid december meeting, i'd said it's more than at risk. racing have said they categorically will not take part without the english. it has been rumoured toulouse are similarly positioned.

                            i reckon the "6n governance" euro cup excluding the french is more likely at this stage. providing they can pay off sky.

                            or none at all.
                            No, the French clubs have signed up to whatever the FFR have signed up to. Anything else is posturing/face saving. That was part of the deal that allowed them to get their new PA in time to renegotiate their own TV deal.

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                              Originally posted by exiled to connacht View Post
                              12 + 4 ?

                              We were discussing a 2 tier B+I league. I was assuming that meant 2 divisions of 12. Maybe I'm wrong.

                              Point - the French haven't officially confirmed anything yet. FFR want a FIRA controlled competition and apparently we are against that. LNR meanwhile are as quiet as PRL. I think I preferred it when they were in media every day.
                              We are against that as currently proposed. There is nothing to stop Camou coming back with a revised offer with Celtalian safeguards built in. I hope they do, not just for the Celtalians, but for the development of rugby as a whole.

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                                Am I the only one who wouldn't be enthused by a British and Irish league? Doesn't excite me in the least.

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