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The Future of the Heineken Cup In Doubt?

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    Originally posted by Thomond78 View Post
    The Italians didn't join the league until 2010. Since then, Treviso's results have gone: 10, 10, 7. Results going upwards. The last one finishing ahead of Connacht. With Glasgow in the playoffs.

    Another Outlaw fact-check special.
    You didn't add the Zebre facts I notice. You're great at picking out the little bits but ignoring the big picture.

    the facts are Scotland have one side capable of playing HEC rugby. The Italians have none.

    Treviso have won 4 games since 2004 in the HEC. Thats right folks- 4 games.

    Connacht have won 4 HEC games in two years.

    You do the maths.
    I always knew Madigan was a closet Scrum Half. Ignore All things that suggest Continuity.

    Comment


      Originally posted by sewa View Post
      Its a jolly with your D4 mates. You probably wont even watch the game.
      160 mile round trip. Long way from D4.

      Comment


        Originally posted by sewa View Post
        Ah munsterboy is really losing it now, you cant force competition. If hypothetically speaking Limerick rugby gets in house in order and starts producing a bucket load of players like it used to we will be the best team in Europe again and no artificial attempts to level the playing pitch will stop it

        Yes, you can. The NFL has had 7 different winners in the last 10 years because they do have very simple ways of forcing competition, like the draft and the salary cap and salary floor. It's good for everybody. Wiping out the weak until there are only a few left is self-defeating.

        Honestly, do you actually think about or research this stuff at all or just spout whatever pops into your head?

        Comment


          How would the three League winners play off against each other? It would be better off if you found two more teams to bring the total to 40.

          Then you could have 4 conferences, each with 10 teams.

          The Celtic Conference: Irish, Scottish Welsh.
          The Saxon Conference: Newcastle, Leeds, Sale, Leicester, Bath, Northampton, Gloucester, Worcester, Exeter, London Irish.
          The Norman Conference: Harlequins, Saracens, Wasps, Stade Francais, Racing Metro, Clermont, La Rochelle, Toulouse, Castres Bordeaux-Begles.
          The Alpine Conference: Zebre, Treviso, Montpellier, USAP, BOPB, Oyonnax, Grenoble, Toulon, Brive, Bayonne.
          Last edited by Piquet; 13th-September-2013, 14:51.

          Comment


            Originally posted by The Outlaw View Post
            You didn't add the Zebre facts I notice. You're great at picking out the little bits but ignoring the big picture.

            the facts are Scotland have one side capable of playing HEC rugby. The Italians have none.

            Treviso have won 4 games since 2004 in the HEC. Thats right folks- 4 games.

            Connacht have won 4 HEC games in two years.

            You do the maths.
            Treviso, last year: pool of death, lost to Tigers by a point, beat the Ospreys.

            And finished above Connacht in the league.
            Ceterum censeo INM irrumandum esse.

            Comment


              Thomas: No way FFR and IRB will approve new cup

              Former Rugby Football Union (RFU) chairman Martyn Thomas has claimed the English clubs are obliged to play in the Heineken Cup until the end of the 2014-15 campaign.Premiership Rugby (PRL) stated on Tuesday that it and the Ligue Nationale de Rugby (LNR) have agreed to set up a breakaway European tournament for the start of next season. Both organisations served their notice to ERC at the end of last season with LNR and PRL saying they will leave the Heineken Cup. The duo harbour reservations against the qualification process for the tournament and the distribution of votes and revenue.
              Despite ERC's statement on Wednesday claiming all stakeholders were still committed to finding a solution under the current organisation, counter commentsfrom representatives of PRL and LNR suggest the breakaway tournament is still at the forefront of their plans for next season.
              However, any new tournament will need approval from the RFU and French Rugby Federation (FFR) and Thomas claims his former employers can enforce a rule which would see English teams staying in the Heineken Cup until 2015.
              "There's a contractual obligation there that the RFU can enforce," Thomas told the BBC. "It not only provides that they will play in Europe to the end of the season 2014-2015, it also provides that they will play in no other professional competitions."
              And Thomas says he expects the FFR and the International Rugby Board to reject any plans for a new breakaway tournament. "The clubs in England require the consent of their union, the teams in France require the consent of their union," Thomas added. "Pierre Camou is probably one of the strongest presidents in world rugby - he is a tough guy.
              "Also, because it's a cross border they require the consent of the IRB and they have a French chairman in Bernard Lapasset. There is no way that those two Frenchmen are going to give consent for this to occur."
              While Thomas is expecting a flat refusal from the FFR and IRB, Leicester Tigers chairman Peter Tom said on Thursday he is hopeful the RFU will see the benefits of the new club-run competition.


              http://www.espn.co.uk/heineken-cup-2...ry/198257.html

              Comment


                Wheeler is now claiming the ERC Board did NOT authorise a statement saying the ERC has to run European competition.

                One would ask why, if he says it was a blatant lie with his name below it, he took several days to bestir himself.

                Now, Wheeler is a director of ERC. As such, he has a ficuciary duty to ERC.

                He is also a director of PRL. And owes a similar ficuciary duty to PRL.

                So, can one discharge a ficuciary duty to one company and to the one actively seeking to shut the first down?
                Ceterum censeo INM irrumandum esse.

                Comment


                  Originally posted by Thomond78 View Post
                  Treviso, last year: pool of death, lost to Tigers by a point, beat the Ospreys.

                  And finished above Connacht in the league.
                  They have been playing HEC rugby since 1995. And have made zero impact.

                  They do not deserve a place in any revamped competition unless they qualify for it. We've beaten the English Champions and another who have a stellar history in the competition (serge created or otherwise) in 2 years.

                  They have no right to a HEC place over any other unless they qualify for it. This lets give them a place for the sake of it is balderdash in my view.
                  I always knew Madigan was a closet Scrum Half. Ignore All things that suggest Continuity.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by dropkick View Post
                    While Thomas is expecting a flat refusal from the FFR and IRB, Leicester Tigers chairman Peter Tom said on Thursday he is hopeful the RFU will see the benefits of the new club-run competition.

                    Now the truth comes out. At least partially. What they really mean is "English and French club-run tournament."
                    Last edited by Piquet; 13th-September-2013, 15:05.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by Thomond78 View Post
                      Wheeler is now claiming the ERC Board did NOT authorise a statement saying the ERC has to run European competition.

                      One would ask why, if he says it was a blatant lie with his name below it, he took several days to bestir himself.

                      Now, Wheeler is a director of ERC. As such, he has a ficuciary duty to ERC.

                      He is also a director of PRL. And owes a similar ficuciary duty to PRL.

                      So, can one discharge a ficuciary duty to one company and to the one actively seeking to shut the first down?
                      It's like the Levi Logo
                      Click image for larger version

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                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Thomond78 View Post
                        Wheeler is now claiming the ERC Board did NOT authorise a statement saying the ERC has to run European competition.

                        One would ask why, if he says it was a blatant lie with his name below it, he took several days to bestir himself.

                        Now, Wheeler is a director of ERC. As such, he has a ficuciary duty to ERC.

                        He is also a director of PRL. And owes a similar ficuciary duty to PRL.

                        So, can one discharge a ficuciary duty to one company and to the one actively seeking to shut the first down?
                        Click image for larger version

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                        Ethically speaking...

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                          Originally posted by The Outlaw View Post
                          They have been playing HEC rugby since 1995. And have made zero impact.

                          They do not deserve a place in any revamped competition unless they qualify for it. We've beaten the English Champions and another who have a stellar history in the competition (serge created or otherwise) in 2 years.

                          They have no right to a HEC place over any other unless they qualify for it. This lets give them a place for the sake of it is balderdash in my view.
                          And they've beaten Perpignan, an equally famous team, and the reigning Pro12 champions. And it took a dodgy penalty try to prevent them beating the reigning English champions.

                          BTW, the official ERC stats are here. Played 90 HEC; won 18. Seven wins since 2004. Not 4; 7.

                          http://m.ercrugby.com/eng/matchcentr...on_treviso.php

                          Dig up.
                          Last edited by Thomond78; 13th-September-2013, 15:31.
                          Ceterum censeo INM irrumandum esse.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by Thomond78 View Post
                            And they've beaten Perpignan, an equally famous team, and the reigning Pro12 champions. And it took a dodgy penalty try to prevent them beating the reigning English champions.

                            BTW, the official ERC stats are here. Played 90 HEC; won 18. Seven wins since 2004. Not 4; 7.

                            http://m.ercrugby.com/eng/matchcentr...on_treviso.php

                            Dig up.
                            They have seven wins including the 2004 season. Since then they have 4 wins.

                            You can't come up with even one coherent reason as to why they should be in a revamped HEC except that "they are Italian". And we must keep them competitive

                            Its no wonder really the French and English want out.
                            I always knew Madigan was a closet Scrum Half. Ignore All things that suggest Continuity.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by The Outlaw View Post
                              They have seven wins including the 2004 season. Since then they have 4 wins.

                              You can't come up with even one coherent reason as to why they should be in a revamped HEC except that "they are Italian". And we must keep them competitive
                              But those are good reasons, for the overall benefit of the game of rugby - considered as a whole.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by The Outlaw View Post
                                They have seven wins including the 2004 season. Since then they have 4 wins.

                                You can't come up with even one coherent reason as to why they should be in a revamped HEC except that "they are Italian". And we must keep them competitive

                                Its no wonder really the French and English want out.
                                You do realise that the consequences of no HC are likely to be as follows:

                                Less money for IRFU
                                Less money for Leinster, Munster & Ulster
                                Therefore scrap the development province.

                                Kind of sad but probably true. After all, they have made little or no impact on the Rabo league.

                                Comment

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