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    Porter.. and that’s a work in progress.

    Scannell couldn't dislodge the captain of the team, from selection made by a coach who had a very strong tendency to be loyal to players who have served him well. Cronin didn’t make much progress dislodging best either. If Scannell doesn’t nail down the starting position for Munster ( and there’s a decent amonunt of IQ competition there), then he has no right to the jersey.

    Comment


      Originally posted by Talking Sense View Post

      Thats a very IJWT inference there MB, I cant stand the sort of comments that start with "oh so because youve said this, do you seriously suggest that?"

      Im saying that I think hes the real deal and I think he should start in the 6N cause if Scannell cant dislodge a 37 yr old then theres no hope for him. Obviously that statement also implies that Kelleher will do well for Leinster in the meantime, if he doesnt then fine.

      Please do give me plenty of examples of where we fast track a starlet into the team and refuse to consider anyone else, you say we 'have just as much a tendancy' so you must have countless examples.

      Now that you mention it, who was the last starlet we fast tracked into the team and how has he fared?
      Larmer
      I am the million man.

      Comment


        Originally posted by Talking Sense View Post

        Thats a very IJWT inference there MB, I cant stand the sort of comments that start with "oh so because youve said this, do you seriously suggest that?"

        Im saying that I think hes the real deal and I think he should start in the 6N cause if Scannell cant dislodge a 37 yr old then theres no hope for him. Obviously that statement also implies that Kelleher will do well for Leinster in the meantime, if he doesnt then fine.

        Please do give me plenty of examples of where we fast track a starlet into the team and refuse to consider anyone else, you say we 'have just as much a tendancy' so you must have countless examples.

        Now that you mention it, who was the last starlet we fast tracked into the team and how has he fared?
        The two lads got in ahead of me with Porter and Larmour.

        Porter has come on reasonably well but what did he do to be nailed on second choice?

        Larmour is also developing well now but should he have been ahead of Conway all this time?

        Stockdale is another. Fast tracked, did well, but seemingly undroppable despite a loss of form.

        And I didn’t infer anything. Your statement that Kelleher “should start the 6Ns” implies he should start the 6Ns.

        If what you mean is, “if Kelleher shows he’s the best hooker in Ireland when tested in European competition, and against full strength Pro14 sides, over the coming couple of months, he should start the 6Ns” then we agree, but it’s not what you said.

        Comment


          I find it a bit bizarre that you’re all citing guys who don’t start as having been fast tracked. Making the bench isn’t exactly that.

          Larmour clearly showed in the WC that he should have been fast tracked more and given Robs jersey so he doesn’t come under that category. Porter is overhyped but he has scrummaged well in general and offers that extra cover on the bench so I guess that’s why. Stockdale is an example yes but hard to omit given how much credit he earned from 2018 6n and his obvious natural talent.

          Im all for competition but I also firmly believe our planning and succession leaves so much to be desired. The teams we are aiming to beat are miles ahead of us in this regard. If we don’t change this we ll never get past a qf, the central contracts don’t help with this. Like I said before if Joe and the Irfu were based in england, robshaw parling Haskell and brown would have been starting for England.
          \"Only Pienaar, Botha and Ferris would be in contention for a place on our first 15. That\'s a fact.\" - Tickettout\'s take on Ulster April 2011.

          Comment


            Originally posted by Talking Sense View Post
            I find it a bit bizarre that you’re all citing guys who don’t start as having been fast tracked. Making the bench isn’t exactly that.

            Larmour clearly showed in the WC that he should have been fast tracked more and given Robs jersey so he doesn’t come under that category. Porter is overhyped but he has scrummaged well in general and offers that extra cover on the bench so I guess that’s why. Stockdale is an example yes but hard to omit given how much credit he earned from 2018 6n and his obvious natural talent.

            Im all for competition but I also firmly believe our planning and succession leaves so much to be desired. The teams we are aiming to beat are miles ahead of us in this regard. If we don’t change this we ll never get past a qf, the central contracts don’t help with this. Like I said before if Joe and the Irfu were based in england, robshaw parling Haskell and brown would have been starting for England.
            Should Larmour have been fast tracked ahead of Conway or should he have to have actually earned it?

            Thing is, you’re not calling for competition, you’re calling for a guy to be immediately installed because he’s played well in a few Pro14 games against weakened opposition.

            That’s not competition, that’s hype. Now the other lads are back, let’s see how they go.
            Last edited by Munsterboy; 14th-November-2019, 17:16.

            Comment


              Originally posted by Talking Sense View Post
              I find it a bit bizarre that you’re all citing guys who don’t start as having been fast tracked. Making the bench isn’t exactly that.

              Larmour clearly showed in the WC that he should have been fast tracked more and given Robs jersey so he doesn’t come under that category. Porter is overhyped but he has scrummaged well in general and offers that extra cover on the bench so I guess that’s why. Stockdale is an example yes but hard to omit given how much credit he earned from 2018 6n and his obvious natural talent.

              Im all for competition but I also firmly believe our planning and succession leaves so much to be desired. The teams we are aiming to beat are miles ahead of us in this regard. If we don’t change this we ll never get past a qf, the central contracts don’t help with this. Like I said before if Joe and the Irfu were based in england, robshaw parling Haskell and brown would have been starting for England.
              Larmour couldn't dislodge Rob at Leinster, Conway couldn't dislodge Haley at Munster and yet most people think they should be picked at fullback at International ahead of players who provincial coaches think are better than them.

              When it comes to competition though Murray hasn't played well in about 12 months or so, POM hasn't been playing well for a good period of time, Earls was injured going into the RWC and yet I don't see you arguing that they should have been dropped/excluded from the team/squad.

              If competition is required for places Leinster beat Munster 8 out of the 10 games in the last RWC cycle including in semi-finals in the last two years and yet a lot of people still think that has no bearing in more Leinster players being picked.

              Comment


                Originally posted by In Joe we trust View Post

                Larmour couldn't dislodge Rob at Leinster, Conway couldn't dislodge Haley at Munster and yet most people think they should be picked at fullback at International ahead of players who provincial coaches think are better than them.

                When it comes to competition though Murray hasn't played well in about 12 months or so, POM hasn't been playing well for a good period of time, Earls was injured going into the RWC and yet I don't see you arguing that they should have been dropped/excluded from the team/squad.

                If competition is required for places Leinster beat Munster 8 out of the 10 games in the last RWC cycle including in semi-finals in the last two years and yet a lot of people still think that has no bearing in more Leinster players being picked.
                What utter nonsense.

                It's clear that Schmidt was overly loyal in certain selections, and failed to innovate tactically.

                I'll ignore the rather obvious and sad digs. Why do you continue this rubbish on a Munster rugby site?

                p.s. I wonder is Super Rob still first choice in D4?
                Yorn desh born, der ritt de gitt der gue,
                Orn desh, dee born desh, de umn bork! bork! bork!

                Comment


                  It's clear that Schmidt was overly loyal in certain selections, and failed to innovate tactically.
                  I'd agree with the first - he was far too loyal to a rake of players, but the alternatives were either injured, hadn't proven themselves or were grand average players. I don't think playing Jack Carty instead of Sexton would have improved anything, and too many other calls were much of a muchness.

                  In terms of tactical innovation, I think that is rubbish. If we executed the plan, we would have done fine at the World Cup. We never did - we were sloppy and ill-disciplined throughout every match bar the Scottish one.
                  Last edited by Rabb1tts Jump; 15th-November-2019, 14:27.

                  Comment


                    Leinster team to play Benetton tomorrow, KO 3:15pm

                    Jordan Larmour; Dave Kearney, Garry Ringrose, Joe Tomane, James Lowe; Johnny Sexton, Luke McGrath; Cian Healy, Ronan Kelleher, Andrew Porter; Devin Toner, James Ryan; Rhys Ruddock, Josh vd Flier, Caelan Doris

                    James Tracy, Peter Dooley, Michael Bent, Scott Fardy, Max Deegan, Jamison Gibson-Park, Ross Byrne, Rory O'Loughlin

                    Comment


                      End of era. Super Rob has been put out to grass.
                      Yorn desh born, der ritt de gitt der gue,
                      Orn desh, dee born desh, de umn bork! bork! bork!

                      Comment


                        Is Keats playing for Treviso?
                        "There are a lot of points that we’ve left behind and this is with a young group. That probably tells you what they’re capable of and that they’re a very good side.

                        Probably next year or the year after next they will take some stopping"

                        Anthony Foley, May 2016. Axel RIP

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Miguel Sanchez View Post
                          End of era. Super Rob has been put out to grass.
                          Naw- just being held back for the more important games.

                          Comment


                            No sign of Tadhg either- is he injured? Very surprised to see Sexton there- wonder if he feels he has something to prove in order to keep his green shirt.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by Munsterboy View Post

                              The two lads got in ahead of me with Porter and Larmour.

                              Porter has come on reasonably well but what did he do to be nailed on second choice?

                              Larmour is also developing well now but should he have been ahead of Conway all this time?

                              Stockdale is another. Fast tracked, did well, but seemingly undroppable despite a loss of form.

                              And I didn’t infer anything. Your statement that Kelleher “should start the 6Ns” implies he should start the 6Ns.

                              If what you mean is, “if Kelleher shows he’s the best hooker in Ireland when tested in European competition, and against full strength Pro14 sides, over the coming couple of months, he should start the 6Ns” then we agree, but it’s not what you said.
                              Is Conway's biggest problem not that he can’t get a look in at 15 for Munster. If he can’t get ahead of Haley who a lot of Munster fans rate as average how dose he clear both Haley and JL for Ireland. I know JL played some right wing at leinster but he plays mostly at 15. Like a lot of folks here id Like to see Conway play more in green but at the moment you would imagine he’s looking for a wing spot.

                              Agree about people jumping the gun with Kelleher but everything is looking very promising at the moment and it’s hard not to get carried away.
                              Last edited by Joe Konys barmy army; 16th-November-2019, 01:37.
                              “One, Fineen needs to be louder, angrier, and have access to a time machine. Two, whenever Fineen’s not on field, all the other players should be asking 'Where's Fineen?

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Joe Konys barmy army View Post

                                Is Conway's biggest problem not that he can’t get a look in at 15 for Munster. If he can’t get ahead of Haley who a lot of Munster fans rate as average how dose he clear both Haley and JL for Ireland. I know JL played some right wing at leinster but he plays mostly at 15. Like a lot of folks here id Like to see Conway play more in green but at the moment you would imagine he’s looking for a wing spot.

                                Agree about people jumping the gun with Kelleher but everything is looking very promising at the moment and it’s hard not to get carried away.
                                Conway’s problem at Munster isn’t that he’s not better than Haley (which he still is, although Mike is going well now), it’s that he’s better than our other wingers (bar Earls) by a bigger margin.

                                Larmour was not first choice for Leinster either, and had played and achieved far less than Conway when fast tracked into the Irish squad. Conway continued to out-perform him but the younger man had been anointed as the “next big thing” and that was that.

                                Doing the same with Kelleher (or any other young lad) after a few uncompetitive Pro14 games is a mistake, unnecessary and the opposite of proper competition. We’re four years from a RWC.

                                Comment

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