Denis Hurley for Ireland

[Thomond78]

Would hurley start for the Lions?

No. But neither would a non-tackling fullback. Halfpenny would have it locked down.

[The Outlaw]

No. But neither would a non-tackling fullback. Halfpenny would have it locked down.

Kearney has already played (well) for the Lions.

[Thomond78]

Kearney has already played (well) for the Lions.

Four seasons ago. You might as well say that Wallace will be playing 7.

[Tobyglen]

The Rob Kearney of 2009, yes. The Rob Kearney ushering through Gray and others like the guy in the top hat at the door of Brown Thomas? Hmmmm...

Talking utter rubbish AGAIN. Did you see his performance against Clermont in the semi last season? One of the finest I have seen from a FB in recent years.
Kearney was excellent last year, ERC player of the tournament. His tackling can be poor sometimes but his attacking game, kicking, fielding, positional sense, passing are top drawer. He's a shoe in to go on the Lions tour & favourite to start. Denis Hurley is not international standard.

[The Outlaw]

Four seasons ago. You might as well say that Wallace will be playing 7.

Hurley wont be playing for the lions next year.

Kearney with his limitations defensively and at times offensively(although he has improved on this) still has a hell of a career resume.

I think Hurley has done very well to get to where he has. But he's unlikely to be a full international.

[Thomond78]

Talking utter rubbish AGAIN. Did you see his performance against Clermont in the semi last season? One of the finest I have seen from a FB in recent years.
Kearney was excellent last year, ERC player of the tournament. His tackling can be poor sometimes but his attacking game, kicking, fielding, positional sense, passing are top drawer. He's a shoe in to go on the Lions tour & favourite to start. Denis Hurley is not international standard.

Yeah, Gatland's going to pick him ahead of the guy who won the GS by creasing Strettle in a last-ditch tackle, knocks over penalties from 50m and hasn't been exposed at test level as a weakness. Tell you what, why not apply the same "looks good at HEC so Lions shoo-in" to D'Arcy? How did that go in the past?

[dropkick]

He's quick at full speed, it's his acceleration thats the problem. A guy with a quick turn of pace will have left him for dead by the time he's got through the gears.
.

Thats his biggest weakness. Acceleration is more important than being fast. Hurley might be fast over 100m but its the short bursts that get players through gaps. For example BOD is very fast over the short distance but not very fast over 100m. Felix Jones scored a try against Aironi that Hurley would not have scored.

Jones will make more line breaks than Hurley and seeing that Munster like to pass the ball around and stretch defenses, more gaps will appear. JJ Hanrahan scored 2 tries the other day starting his first match in the center. Downey and Lualala have 0 tries in 19 matches. JJ has a burst of speed over the short distance that enables him to make line breaks.

Hurley has 0 tries in 7 (6 starts, 1 sub) games this season. Jones has 1 try in 2 (1 start 1 ) games this season.
Overall Hurley has 6 tries in 98 (78 starts, 20 sub) games for Munster. Jones has 5 tries in 29 games (26 starts, 3 sub) for Munster.

I'm not knocking Hurley but I think he runs too straight and is a bit too slow off the mark to be international class. Sometimes a solid reliable fullback is better to have than an error prone speedster but the way Munster are playing it suits a player like Felix Jones.

[dropkick]

Halfpenny will start for the Lions I'd say. He is probably Wales' most important player.

[Thomond78]

Hurley wont be playing for the lions next year.

Kearney with his limitations defensively and at times offensively(although he has improved on this) still has a hell of a career resume.

I think Hurley has done very well to get to where he has. But he's unlikely to be a full international.

Oh, agreed, Hurley won't be in Australia. He is capable of playing at test level, I reckon (which was the question given Kearney's out, and now overtaken by events). However, for all Kearney's nice aerial stuff, that won't cut it with Gatland and Edwards if he isn't making his tackles. Halfpenny would be heading the pack there, given his kicking.

[Tobyglen]

Yeah, Gatland's going to pick him ahead of the guy who won the GS by creasing Strettle in a last-ditch tackle, knocks over penalties from 50m and hasn't been exposed at test level as a weakness. Tell you what, why not apply the same "looks good at HEC so Lions shoo-in" to D'Arcy? How did that go in the past?

Did you see Halfpenny's tackling this season?
He got the Richie Gray try badly wrong. His gambled that Gray would pass & got it horribly wrong. It happens. His tackling is his weakness but he's not awful.
His MOM performances against SA, away in Australia 2 years back count for nothing. His starring role in the Lions tour in 2009? Exposed? You're tackling through your hoop. Go out & get some fresh air, you've spent the last month stuck to a keyboard. Kearney is one of Ireland's best players, he reeks of class when fully fit.

[ustix]

Who calls him Sonny Bill Hurley?

Excellence always merits mention, in this case your own.
Imo, Denis is a good player, not a great player.
More of the Wolfhound about him than a Lion.
Now, JJ Hanrahan, there's a Lion.

[joconnell]

What'll be interesting to see though is with Kiss as full time attack coach now, will there be a coherent attacking plan to make use of our players? If not, hurley might be solid enough at the back with the likes of Earls and Murray having to be aware that they may have to sweep back to cover Hurley's pace at times. On levels of talent I'd have Jones ahead of him if he had more game time, earls next save for his aerial safety, then hurley who's fairly solid.

[Downsouthdukin]

the problem for Denis Hurley is he builds up a head of steam with some terrific performances, merits inclusion in the first team then drops the ball, figuratively... Last season a string of good performances on the wing got him correctly selected against Ulster where he had a poor game and was skinned by Gilroy. as far back as when he surprisingly took Paynes place in the quarters against Glaws in 2008, had a blinder then was completely anonymous in the finals.
terrific hands, runs good lines and a hard tackler just not consistent enough to be a top international. smashing club player though and like Johne Mrphy Im glad to have them complement a talented squad

[Thomond78]

You mean, the game we lost 2 tries to nil in Australia? Or are you hanging your argument on something that happened four years ago, instead of this spring?

[Tobyglen]

the problem for Denis Hurley is he builds up a head of steam with some terrific performances, merits inclusion in the first team then drops the ball, figuratively... Last season a string of good performances on the wing got him correctly selected against Ulster where he had a poor game and was skinned by Gilroy. as far back as when he surprisingly took Paynes place in the quarters against Glaws in 2008, had a blinder then was completely anonymous in the finals.
terrific hands, runs good lines and a hard tackler just not consistent enough to be a top international. smashing club player though and like Johne Mrphy Im glad to have them complement a talented squad

Agree with all that.

[ustix]

I'd sooner Denis Hurley for Ireland than Chalara fraxinea

[Evil Omer]

Thats his biggest weakness. Acceleration is more important than being fast. Hurley might be fast over 100m but its the short bursts that get players through gaps. For example BOD is very fast over the short distance but not very fast over 100m. Felix Jones scored a try against Aironi that Hurley would not have scored.

Jones will make more line breaks than Hurley and seeing that Munster like to pass the ball around and stretch defenses, more gaps will appear. JJ Hanrahan scored 2 tries the other day starting his first match in the center. Downey and Lualala have 0 tries in 19 matches. JJ has a burst of speed over the short distance that enables him to make line breaks.

Hurley has 0 tries in 7 (6 starts, 1 sub) games this season. Jones has 1 try in 2 (1 start 1 ) games this season.
Overall Hurley has 6 tries in 98 (78 starts, 20 sub) games for Munster. Jones has 5 tries in 29 games (26 starts, 3 sub) for Munster.

I'm not knocking Hurley but I think he runs too straight and is a bit too slow off the mark to be international class. Sometimes a solid reliable fullback is better to have than an error prone speedster but the way Munster are playing it suits a player like Felix Jones.

depends upon position as well though. Hurley running from full back, as he showed on the recent break, has time to build up speed and has the size and power to break through the first tackle. I doubt he'll ever be a regular international but the rugby he's playing now is very good and he's a massively under-rated footballer by most on here. Has much better skills than people think. But that additional size makes up for some of the initial lack of pace

[Hugged Rugger]

Would be interested to see his assist stats. Still reckon he's probably not intentional standard long term but could certainly do a job when needed and try stats aren't the only consideration

[deadlyBuzz]

normally i'd be screaming "hell yeah" at the suggestion of Hurley for Ireland, but after Kilcoyne has been consigned to holding tackebags for a month instead of actually playing, i'm holding back.
we know he can tackle as good as anyone on the pitch on his day (that tackle on the flying toulon prop in tp 2 years ago was sublime) and if we were still seeing asmuch sonny bill style offloads as last year, i'd be all for sonny bill hurley deserving a call up.
but the new ireland would only call him up for cover while we'd play trimble or fitzgerald there instead and he deserves better treatment than that.
yes he has deserved a call up in the past, maybe he should get one now we're hit by injuries but i cant see kidney playing him, not if he's waited this long to play him

[Aussiedub]

You mean, the game we lost 2 tries to nil in Australia? Or are you hanging your argument on something that happened four years ago, instead of this spring?

Did you see Wales against Aus where they lost all 3 tests and Halfpenny did SFA including missing a number of tackles or every other game Wales have played against Aus in the last few years...

[5eight]

Hurley isn't the first cousin of a test player never mind a Lion. Honestly, the delusion on here is startling, liking him to Sonny Bill and now a Lion, the mind boggles.

[mtcmolloy]

depends upon position as well though. Hurley running from full back, as he showed on the recent break, has time to build up speed and has the size and power to break through the first tackle. I doubt he'll ever be a regular international but the rugby he's playing now is very good and he's a massively under-rated footballer by most on here. Has much better skills than people think. But that additional size makes up for some of the initial lack of pace

I'm also surprised this thread exists, but here's what I think. Hurley is a big unit, and that's why I suggested he be tried at 12. I watched a long thin delon armitage win a man of the match gong last week down the road from me. Now there is a mobile fullback, that kinda gets you excited when he elects to run with the ball. He's tall, like hurley, but he's stick thin, and fast as f***. If hurley ever had that kind of 'je ne sais pas' va va voom, it was 2008 when he looked a stone lighter.
Then again, you look at a heavy fullback like steyn and he seems to have huge mobility, so I don't know.
I just always have this idea that dinny could benefit more from speedwork, and less gymwork.. I don't think he'll be capped in a major international, and I'd be happier to see earls or madigan there.

[rua13]

Hurley would never have scored the try jones got v zebre , he lacks pace/footwork to be an international

[barleys chinos]

Hurley would never have scored the try jones got v zebre , he lacks pace/footwork to be an international

You do know zebre are far from international?(good try by jones all the same))
Pace and footwork another much trotted out phrase much like golf fans when they dont know whats happening shout out GET IN THE HOLE.
This Hurley is slow is becoming a bored fact with little basis,(gilroy gilroy)
Hurley is playing very well at the minute and as some except ross can scrum but little else, i except hurley wont be skinning players with bolt like pace but is more than solid everywhere else.

[Munsterboy]

So many people here seem to lack a basic appreciation of what's required of a good fullback.

Blinding acceleration is not a critical part of a FB's game. They are typically running from deep and have time to get up to speed. Hurley is actually pretty quick over distance, as is the excellent Rob Kearney, as was Girvan Dempsey before him. However, none of them have BOD-like acceleration or footwork. That hasn't hindered any of them because it simply doesn't matter. BOD's a fecking centre and needs to be quick off the mark and quick on his feet. The requirements of a FB are completely different.

People also keep beating Hurley with the Gilroy stick. He was not simply skinned in a one-on-one. Watch the video (especially replays from behind the Munster posts where you can see the match-ups). He had to come in to take Terblanche (another excellent FB without massive acceleration) and that left space for Gilroy to go outside him. Jones (the great white hope) was the last man, he was poorly positioned and he made a balls of the tackle.

Anyway, why choose an example of when Hurley was on the wing to argue against him at FB? Again, the requirements of the position are a lot more different than people think. I keep hearing that Denis will be exposed by the "speedsters" but I have yet to see this happen when he's at FB. On the other hand, I do see him taking high balls, running good lines, offloading, tackling better than any other FB in Ireland and generally doing his job very well.

Would I pick him ahead of Kearney? No. Would I pick him ahead of Jones or a hastily converted winger or OH? Absolutely.

[barleys chinos]

[QUOTE=5eight;1130064]Hurley isn't the first cousin of a test player never mind a Lion.
No but his father played for munster.

[5eight]

[QUOTE=barleys chinos;1130101]

Hurley isn't the first cousin of a test player never mind a Lion.
No but his father played for munster.

Very clever, I see what you've done there. Very clever indeed.

[Dowlinz]

For all the limitations of Hurley I'd still agree he's a better player than Jones who IMO is Munster's most overrated player. Keatley is running him close these days but the murmurs of international starts after 1 appearance against Zebre has Felix retaining that title for the time being.

[sewa]

Rancid bait Dowlinz, must try harder

[lactose intolerant]

Rancid bait Dowlinz, must try harder

Aye, not even sure if the concept had potential, but the execution was absolutely woejus!!