Viable long term **Hooker** for Munster??!!

[kelly-da-bomb]

With all due respects to Munster's current crop of No. 2's, we seem to have been seriously under pressure from scrum to lineout since Fla's time on the sidelines to eventual retirement, which is over 2 seasons now.

Varley, whilst a solid player, will never be up to Fla's standards IMO. I've lost count of the amount of times I've seen him blow a throw right over the top of lineouts etc...

Its such a crucial position in the modern game and sets a solid platform for set-piece attacking play, I'd love to see a long term player coming in in the form of Fla incarnate.

Does he exist in the Munster setup? I honestly can't see that he does.

[isola ciarrai]

Niall Scannell was strong and a leader in Under 20 RWC recently. Hrady bit of stuff doing well with Dolphin in AIL.

[Evil Omer]

Scannell is the long term future but I honestly think (as I've said before) Varley hit a purple patch and he's now back to his real standard, which ain't that bad but simply isn't top level. There's a reason he was drifting around for years into his mid 20s.

[Balla Boy]

Sherry?

[munsterforever]

Sherry will make it. hes the real deal. hes a winner. he will bulk up in the next cupla years and be a formidable scrummager. hes got everything else already.it took fleadh years to get to sherrys accuracy

[Christy]

Varley, whilst a solid player, will never be up to Fla's standards IMO. I've lost count of the amount of times I've seen him blow a throw right over the top of lineouts etc...

That is not necessarily the hookers fault when the ball goes completely over the top. The timing in lifting the receiver in the line out should be questioned also. When Hayes retired you lost a man who could have lifted the Titanic into orbit with exquisite timing

[Cathal]

Throwing over the top seems to happen more often with Varley in harness than Sherry but only the pack know who/what is actually to blame for that.

[Evil Omer]

The problem with Varley is too often his throw goes wildly over the top of the man even at his full height.

[Bromance]

Sherry and James Rael to be the top 2, Scannell is a leader but i think Rael is potentially a better and more dynamic hooker

[ormond lad]

Sherry, Rael, Scannell, Casey.
plenty of options. 1 on a pro contract who is 24yrs old
3 on academy contracts, 2 who are 20 years of age and the other is 22
Scannell was one of the leaders of the irish 20s side that did so well in the junior world cup last june
All 4 have plenty of time to learn/adjust etc to the first team and have time to make the 2 spot their own

[lactose intolerant]

Sherry....class act

[Red October]

Whatever about hooker - I think we're well served, or soon will be - who will be our nailed on No8 for the next 4/5 years and who will be the nailed on starting 9? Is this POM/Murray?

Because I remain utterly convinced that the 8/9 partnership/understanding is every bit as vital to a team's cohesion, as the 9/10 one; if not moreso. They need to be Borg-like, in Star-Trek parlance.

[Thomond78]

The problem with Varley is too often his throw goes wildly over the top of the man even at his full height.

Yup. He wildly underthrew one on Saturday, too, about a foot over the front-man's head. It was a clear over-compensation. He has the yips.

[Thomond78]

Whatever about hooker - I think we're well served, or soon will be - who will be our nailed on No8 for the next 4/5 years and who will be the nailed on starting 9? Is this POM/Murray?

Because I remain utterly convinced that the 8/9 partnership/understanding is every bit as vital to a team's cohesion, as the 9/10 one; if not moreso. They need to be Borg-like, in Star-Trek parlance.

Foley and Stringer being a great example: the greatest great big brute/cunning midget combo since Obelix and Asterix.

[BOK]

I don't share everyone's optimism for Sherry. TBH I cant see were everyone is getting it from as there isn't a huge load of evidence to base it on imo. To me it seems that both himself and Varley are good impact subs. When either comes off the bench they make a notable difference both in the loose and with their throwing but likewise when either starts they never really stand out and both are guilty of wayward throws. At this point in time I would rate them both on a par with each other. The only thing Sherry has over Varls imo is his age. The fact is neither is ever going to be at the same standard as Fla was but very few are I suppose to be fair.

[JoeyFantastic]

I don't share everyone's optimism for Sherry. TBH I cant see were everyone is getting it from as there isn't a huge load of evidence to base it on imo. To me it seems that both himself and Varley are good impact subs. When either comes off the bench they make a notable difference both in the loose and with their throwing but likewise when either starts they never really stand out and both are guilty of wayward throws. At this point in time I would rate them both on a par with each other. The only thing Sherry has over Varls imo is his age. The fact is neither is ever going to be at the same standard as Fla was but very few are I suppose to be fair.

I don't know. We know what Varley can bring. He's had a run of games over the past three seasons and at times he has been very good but not International standard. Sherry lost a lot of last season due to injury but I'd give him the jersey until Christmas and see how we go, I don't think it's productive to keep chopping and changing.

[Thomond78]

I'm sorry, BOK, but putting Varley's throwing on a par with Sherry's just isn't tenable. With Sherry, you get reliable, accurate ball to where you want it. That allows you to play for territory, put it in the corner, and attack their line. That pressure delivers.

[BOK]

I'm sorry, BOK, but putting Varley's throwing on a par with Sherry's just isn't tenable. With Sherry, you get reliable, accurate ball to where you want it. That allows you to play for territory, put it in the corner, and attack their line. That pressure delivers.

Not always from the off though. He is guilty of wayward throws over 60-70 mins as well (although admittedly not as many as Varls tbf) The reason (and in my opinion the only reason) Sherry is held in higher regard now is because he has spent most of this season coming on for the last 15-20 min and when he has done he has been accurate. The few games he has started I don't think he has out shone Varley at all. Both are good impact subs imo.

I must stress though that this is only how I see it at this point in time. Sherry has the time to surpass Varls. I just hope that if injuries are kind to him he will push on this season and prove the hype to be true.

[Thomond78]

Again, I have to disagree. Sherry was much better than Varley last year, starting, before his injury. Varley's wobbly throwing and iffy discipline have been ongoing for some three years, now. If he hasn't addressed that in that time frame, and at his age, it's reasonable to ask if he ever will. Sherry, by contrast, has improved his scrummaging without other aspects of his game suffering.

[BOK]

Again, I have to disagree. Sherry was much better than Varley last year, starting, before his injury. Varley's wobbly throwing and iffy discipline have been ongoing for some three years, now. If he hasn't addressed that in that time frame, and at his age, it's reasonable to ask if he ever will. Sherry, by contrast, has improved his scrummaging without other aspects of his game suffering.

I do agree there is alot more potential for Sherry to improve than there is for Varley.

[Tipplad]

What about trying to get sean cronin back to provide more competition? At the moment strauss is nailed on starter for leinster. Munster should make a move for him , great carrier.

[OfficePundit]

I don't share everyone's optimism for Sherry. TBH I cant see were everyone is getting it from as there isn't a huge load of evidence to base it on imo. To me it seems that both himself and Varley are good impact subs. When either comes off the bench they make a notable difference both in the loose and with their throwing but likewise when either starts they never really stand out and both are guilty of wayward throws. At this point in time I would rate them both on a par with each other. The only thing Sherry has over Varls imo is his age. The fact is neither is ever going to be at the same standard as Fla was but very few are I suppose to be fair.

That is so idiotic it defies belief. Honestly, some posters here need to learn a lesson about ridiculous hyperbole and the meaning of the word "fact". So it's a "fact" that Sherry who made his heineken debut at the age of 22 and is still only 24 can never reach the level of Flannery who made his debut at 25 and wasn't established until Frankie Sheehan had his injury, at 26. Yes he had an immediate impact but he was also 2 years older. Get a grip please.

[JoeyFantastic]

That is so idiotic it defies belief. Honestly, some posters here need to learn a lesson about ridiculous hyperbole and the meaning of the word "fact". So it's a "fact" that Sherry who made his heineken debut at the age of 22 and is still only 24 can never reach the level of Flannery who made his debut at 25 and wasn't established until Frankie Sheehan had his injury, at 26. Yes he had an immediate impact but he was also 2 years older. Get a grip please.

It's also worth remembering Flannery's throwing was very poor until he was in his mid 20's. Flannery worked hard to be the best thrower in Europe, no reason Sherry or Varley can't do the same.

[tickettout]

I hope Cronin picks up an infection from all the splinters in his arse.

Fla at his peak was a nailed on Lions starter and one of the finest hookers in world rugby.A forward that was geniunely as hard as nails - Consistently leaving the pitch with bust noses and black eyes.
None of our ooptions are likely to scale the heights.

[Thomond78]

It's also worth remembering Flannery's throwing was very poor until he was in his mid 20's. Flannery worked hard to be the best thrower in Europe, no reason Sherry or Varley can't do the same.

That's what annoys me so much about Varley's throwing. He's had the time to sort it, just as Fla sorted it out, but there's no sign of him doing is.

[JoeyFantastic]

That's what annoys me so much about Varley's throwing. He's had the time to sort it, just as Fla sorted it out, but there's no sign of him doing is.

Some people can't sort it. Best, for example, is still prone to awful errors in key positions.

[Thomond78]

Some people can't sort it. Best, for example, is still prone to awful errors in key positions.

But Best has improved, massively, in the last few years. It's that evidence of improvement, of progress, that you'd expect to see.

[JoeyFantastic]

But Best has improved, massively, in the last few years. It's that evidence of improvement, of progress, that you'd expect to see.

So has Varley.

Anyhow, Flannery can in to one of the best lineouts in Europe and improved it. It was already good.

Right now, of our pack, who are guaranteed starters? Botha, POC, Ryan, POM. We can't expect any units to work properly until we've a better idea of who the best pack is. It's easy to blame Varley or Sherry but the entire unit needs to be looked at. You can't have cohesion when we change our pack from week to week.

[dingledaly]

Sherry hasn't had an extended run as the first-choice yet. When he does we should be able to determine whether he has the right stuff or not. Personally I think he will make it. Though he may never reach the heights of Fla, very few could and he could still be an international class No.2.

He should get an extended run as first choice now. It seemed that Penney was veering towards Varley as the first-choice, but surely now that his poor throwing has been exposed Varely will slip down the pecking order.

[Thomond78]

So has Varley.

Anyhow, Flannery can in to one of the best lineouts in Europe and improved it. It was already good.

Right now, of our pack, who are guaranteed starters? Botha, POC, Ryan, POM. We can't expect any units to work properly until we've a better idea of who the best pack is. It's easy to blame Varley or Sherry but the entire unit needs to be looked at. You can't have cohesion when we change our pack from week to week.

Joey, he hasn't. Sorry, but he simply hasn't. His throwing on Saturday was below standard, even allowing for the conditions. What was notable about Dougall's try was that it was the first time in an age Varley has thrown to the tail inside the 22 and hit his man - and we scored. His persistent inaccuracy costs us that platform and removes our ability to go to the corner and increase the pressure.