V Edinburgh. Sun 21 Oct. KO 12:45 Team#264

[Cowboy]

BACKLASH

Its do or die already, lose that and we are dead in the water. Our visitors took a hockeying today and their man in charge will want to show his ability against the home province.

Billy Holland was very good today, I think he may retain his place. I think Dougall was good as well. Killer's engine is improving every single week.

Most of all I hope we begin a process of establishing a plan B for when the high octane stuff isnt on or succeeding. Doesnt have to be globetrotter stuff, just simple and ground gaining. And the lineout needs work a bit.

ROG's hamstring is a bit of a conundrum, do you set up training for the week with Keats at flyhalf or push him back to 15 again?

[Cowboy]

Oh, and Wayneyboy is the whistle carrier:

[mr chips]

Keatley at 10 for me - Hurley IMO offered more in attack from 15. Agree on Holland, he is continuing to be one of our better performers this season.

After Murray's performance today I'm in two minds about him. One one hand, today was surely his worst performance for us, which means he can only get better. On the other hand is there an opportunity for Duncan Williams to replicate his decent form from the early season games? Keatley's greater physicality could equally allow Strings to start, although I don't think that'll happen - plus of course there's the issue of our long-term development.

[Bromance]

Think it'll be a case of same as next week depending on ROGs fitness, see Keats at 10 and Hurley at 15 if he's out. When is Coughlan fit? Need a bit more control at 8 for me! Move POM to 6, Ryan and POC in the row with holland onto the bench if Coughlan is available. Is harsh on Holland cause he's been really good thus far but he'd be the likely man to bite the bullet in my eyes

[joeriddick]

A big performance needed for next week.

Going on today I'd pick:

1. Killer
2. Sherry
3. BJ
4. D.Ryan
5. POC
6. DOC2
7. Dougall
8. POM

9. Murray (he'll be raring to make amends)
10. Keatley

11. Zebo
12. Downey
13. Earls
14. Howlett
15. Hurley

Holland would be benching but Ryan is better placed in the second row and we need some mobility in the back row.

Very impressed with Killer. He should start regardless of WDP's fitness.

[Thomond78]

A big performance needed for next week.

Going on today I'd pick:

1. Killer
2. Sherry
3. BJ
4. D.Ryan
5. POC
6. DOC2
7. Dougall
8. POM

9. Murray (he'll be raring to make amends)
10. Keatley

11. Zebo
12. Downey
13. Earls
14. Howlett
15. Hurley

Holland would be benching but Ryan is better placed in the second row and we need some mobility in the back row.

Very impressed with Killer. He should start regardless of WDP's fitness.

I'd go with that. While keeping a big, fup-off shepherd's crook on the sideline to make the point repeats will. NOT. Be tolerated.

However, I don't think Earls is available?

[Hugh Jardon]

Edinburgh will be getting a bit of a bollocking all week too.

[blackwarrior]

Earls is out "for a number of weeks" ... http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/10944.php

[Mcork]

3 poor performances & losses in a row. I don't expect fireworks next week. It will be tense and confidence will be low for both sides (as it was in the Racing Metro side today). Another bad day weather wise and it will be nail biting stuff IMO. Hopefully Earls is fit. Lualala looks like he needs some time out to get himself together.

[manofmunster]

After Murray's performance today I'm in two minds about him.

I'd deffinitely start him. Nobody will know how much he fupped up today more than himself. He'll be feeling it and - though I was fit to fly out to Paris and strangle him earlier today - I think he deserves a chance to get todays debacle out of his system.

[munsterforever]

A big performance needed for next week.

Going on today I'd pick:

1. Killer
2. Sherry
3. BJ
4. D.Ryan
5. POC
6. DOC2
7. Dougall
8. POM

9. Murray (he'll be raring to make amends)
10. Keatley

11. Zebo
12. Downey
13. Earls
14. Howlett
15. Hurley

Holland would be benching but Ryan is better placed in the second row and we need some mobility in the back row.

Very impressed with Killer. He should start regardless of WDP's fitness.

Ryan is one of my favourite players but he did little to warrant starting in front of someone that played very well in the second row. we have to reward a good performance.In the early Scrums someone was a tractor, was it poc or ryan? perhaps both? theres the blocks there for a good scrummage anyhow. Murray has to bench, it will be good for him in the long run but we both know that isnt going to happen. We will beat edinburgh though and with 5 points, which already is looking like it will be needed.

[FORWARD....]

So weather looks ok for Sunday

[mr chips]

Ryan is one of my favourite players but he did little to warrant starting in front of someone that played very well in the second row. we have to reward a good performance.In the early Scrums someone was a tractor, was it poc or ryan? perhaps both? theres the blocks there for a good scrummage anyhow. Murray has to bench, it will be good for him in the long run but we both know that isnt going to happen. We will beat edinburgh though and with 5 points, which already is looking like it will be needed.

In fairness to Ryan he started in the backrow, a position he hasn't played for a fair while. I felt our scrum got weaker once POC went off though.

The point about starting Murray for a chance at redemption is fair enough, I guess - so long as he takes that chance!

[joeriddick]

I'd go with that. While keeping a big, fup-off shepherd's crook on the sideline to make the point repeats will. NOT. Be tolerated.

However, I don't think Earls is available?

Sh!t, that's right. Laulala it is then. Big improvement needed.

Ryan is one of my favourite players but he did little to warrant starting in front of someone that played very well in the second row. we have to reward a good performance.In the early Scrums someone was a tractor, was it poc or ryan? perhaps both? theres the blocks there for a good scrummage anyhow. Murray has to bench, it will be good for him in the long run but we both know that isnt going to happen. We will beat edinburgh though and with 5 points, which already is looking like it will be needed.

I agree on Holland but D. Ryan's upper potential is higher than Holland's so I'd start him. It's a tough one though, Holland has been impressive.

There is 5 points there against Edinburgh, but we have to earn it. I think the pack above could do that.

[Cowboy]

With Ryan and Paulie butressing Botha up against Yapp I think the scrum can be targetted

[overthehillprop]

Ryan is one of my favourite players but he did little to warrant starting in front of someone that played very well in the second row. we have to reward a good performance.In the early Scrums someone was a tractor, was it poc or ryan? perhaps both? theres the blocks there for a good scrummage anyhow. Murray has to bench, it will be good for him in the long run but we both know that isnt going to happen. We will beat edinburgh though and with 5 points, which already is looking like it will be needed.

Holland was behind Kilcoyne in the scrums and it showed early on when we really got the shove on. was impressed with Holland today. Did a lot of the donkey work that doesn't get many plaudits.

[munsterforever]

sorry OTHP i meant Holland not Ryan tractoring. Holland has come on in leaps and bounds well spotted. He was given a big chance today away, hec, france and he delivered. His confidence will be up on a personal basis.He looked well in the lineout too.it looked so much like a different scrum than we have been used to in recent games so much so that i thought we had found an innovative new way to cheat! this is the conundrum with Varley, do we stick with him for the scrum?...hes very good hooking at scrum time, in the loose Sherry is as good, although Varley competes better at the breakdown but there again gives away crazy peno's...but Sherry can throw and thats an area where varley has always struggled.

[blackwarrior]

I was gutted by today - the performance and the result. Maybe I should be more rational like Tobyglen or JoeRiddick, but I'm not. In any case, I'm not about to rip up my season ticket.

I posted earlier in the week that after 3 successive defeats on the road, the team would be in need of a good dose of Thomond Therapy. The match next week will be about the supporters as much as the team. No more room for error by either.

[joeriddick]

I was gutted by today - the performance and the result. Maybe I should be more rational like Tobyglen or JoeRiddick, but I'm not. In any case, I'm not about to rip up my season ticket.

I posted earlier in the week that after 3 successive defeats on the road, the team would be in need of a good dose of Thomond Therapy. The match next week will be about the supporters as much as the team. No more room for error by either.

Oh I'm gutted too, I just think there's a lot more to this team then that performance.

There's no room for error, that's for certain. There's no wriggle room from here on out.

[Valencia]

We should beat Edin but a 5 pointer based on what? I'm not so sure, but would love to be wrong

[munsterforever]

We should beat Edin but a 5 pointer based on what? I'm not so sure, but would love to be wrong

we are at home with what looks like the beginning of a very good scrum platform. lineout with Sherry throwing is quite good. These two will give us a platform like they did today in the first 20. Sarries played sensibly against Edinburgh..the difference for us as opposed to today hopefully will be keatley running at them fixing defenders and unleashing the backs into holes. hurley dougie zebo and casey are all capable on a decent surface of finding the gaps. zebo esp is in fine form

[joeriddick]

Buddy just dropped in my ticket for the East Terrace. Thomond Park, I will be in you.

[busby]

Keatley to out half, Hurley to full back. DOC in for Holland if fit (no slight on Holland). Sherry in for Varley.

At home, and after the Sarries result, a BP win should be the aim. Above all else though you'd like to see the game plan looking a bit sharper and closer to what we saw in the earlier rounds of the rabo.

[cornerboy]

Keatley at 10 for me - Hurley IMO offered more in attack from 15. Agree on Holland, he is continuing to be one of our better performers this season.

After Murray's performance today I'm in two minds about him. One one hand, today was surely his worst performance for us, which means he can only get better. On the other hand is there an opportunity for Duncan Williams to replicate his decent form from the early season games? Keatley's greater physicality could equally allow Strings to start, although I don't think that'll happen - plus of course there's the issue of our long-term development.

Murray is your number 1 SH. Not starting him sets him back a long way. He starts and redeems his error.

[gavindillon]

So weather looks ok for Sunday

Is the Weather forecaster the only job on the planet where you can consistantly get everything totally wrong and still not get fired. I wouldn't read anything into the weather until the morning of the match?

[lukic]

Personnally myself i just think the last few games we havent showed any sign of creating anything in the backs , Lualala is basically the exact same type of player as Mafi was even though we could of done with the 2 tries he scored in the amlin this weekend, Downey is practically anonymous bar the odd off load and its a no brainer as soon as Earls is back that he is dropped, It would be interesting to see if he Luke O'Dea is fit for the weekends match as i would at this stage rather see a back three of Zebo, Hurley and O'Dea purely based on the youth and pace factor he has over dougie, O'Dea and Zebo have in my opinion been two of the shinning lights in a dull season so far and look like they want to go out and play for the jersey , so for the edinburgh match depending on fitness i am going to shake up the backline a bit here is my starting 15

1. Killer
2. Sherry
3. Botha
4. Ryan
5. O'Connell
6. Holland
7. Dougall
8. O'Mahony

9. Murray ( agree with both sides of the arguments on a few threads , think he is a bit overrated but after yesterday's performance there isnt a man on earth wouldnt want to go out and prove a point)
10. Keatley

11. Zebo
12. Howlett ( yes strange you might ask but he is going to get burned by Visser otherwise , has a wise head on his shoulders and is a consistent tackler think its worth a try at least)
13. Lualala
14. O'Dea If fit
15. Hurley

remember with earls and Jones to come back along with Murphy and hanrahan ( who should be getting more gametime) in the backs there still is a backline worth getting excited about its just having to balls to drop a few "big names and big signings" to get there

[Ragusa]

Earls is out "for a number of weeks" ... http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/10944.php

If that is the case then good night Dick for us !! He seems to be excessively injury prone and must cost Munster a fortune in medical bills/rehab.

[Ragusa]

[/B]
Murray is your number 1 SH. Not starting him sets him back a long way. He starts and redeems his error.

He can sit on the bench and learn a bit about discipline and closing out a game which can be no harm to the learning process.

[Ragusa]

I was gutted by today - the performance and the result. Maybe I should be more rational like Tobyglen or JoeRiddick, but I'm not. In any case, I'm not about to rip up my season ticket.

I posted earlier in the week that after 3 successive defeats on the road, the team would be in need of a good dose of Thomond Therapy. The match next week will be about the supporters as much as the team. No more room for error by either.

For the dose of Thomond Therapy do we bring the cattle prods ??

[The Outlaw]

We should beat Edin but a 5 pointer based on what? I'm not so sure, but would love to be wrong

I cant see you getting out of the group without 5 next sunday. Saracens will beat RM home and away and will pick up 5 against Embra at home.
Embra's form is much closer to the 11th they finished in the Rabo last season then the last 4 of the HEC. Which was an absolute fluke in my opinion.