33-strong Ireland squad for a two day training and preparation camp

[NotreDameRFC]

I'd agree with you there. Having a single Irish grandparent is a pretty tenuous link. Apparently he lists Ireland as one of his favourite holiday destinations though, so he's grand.

I all honesty I think it should be minimum one parent or 5 year residency. No rule will be perfect but it's too easy at the moment.

THere is a chance he spent a weekend in a bedsit on Gardiner st for drunken weekend thanks to cheap flights from o leary during a 12 month sabbatical he had with a dozen other antipodeans in a crowded flat in Kings cross.

[masterchief]

I wouldn't think so. Kids spend more time now with their grandparents than they ever did as generally now, both parents are working and the grandparents are minding them a fair bit.

James McCarthy (footballer) declared for Ireland rather than Scotland because he promised his Irish born grandfather (who used to bring him to soccer matches) that he would.

McGeady was similar IIRC.

[the plastic paddy]

Totally! Sure didn't I get barred for challenging the orthodoxy here on it. The level of rubbish directed at Heaslip here would be shameful if it wasn't laughable. Heaslip's main flaw here is obviously his metropolitan varnish. So even a very talented but flawed player such as our Basque friend is hailed as his better.

I don't think Heaslip is a poor player but to say he is better than the hairy donkey is a bit foolish IMHO; just as a matter of interest, what do you see as the hairy donkey's flaws apart from his old fella being a bit over keen to join in?http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sypud2O8E00

[masterchief]

This is where i disagree....( not saying your wrong chief...we are probably.both wrong or both right)

The guy bent has 1 Irish granny ...and obviously 3 grandparents and 2 parents that are not....and he's never set foot in Ireland....that im aware of.....he's a kiwi plain a simple....


But he qualifies like Strauss does....who had the very least is living and working here for 3 years...

My point is......neither of them are Irish...but both qualify to play...

Imo calling one more Irish than the other is tenuous and not as clear cut as others maintain...

Just an opinion mind....

Good points there alright.

I think I might be slightly biased though mainly because I'm Irish born and reared. My wife is American and our daughter, while born in Ireland, is a citizen of both. We'll end up moving state side in a few years and I'll always be conscious of our daughter's Irishness (plus any future kids we may have).

If she has kids in the future would they be any less Irish just because they're not born in Ireland?

There's no right answers I suppose.

Sorry to go off topic.

[Aussiedub]

Oh yes, hindsight is great.

What happened was that Hayes started with Healy for his first 6 or 7 caps. (AIs & 6Ns 2010). Ireland then went on a tour to NZ & Aus. when Healy & Buckley started together and they did very well. Everyone was raving about Buckley you might remember.

They both started against SA & Argentina together in the AIs, with Tom Court starting at TH against NZ. Buckley was dropped after that and Mike Ross started the in the 6Ns game.

So to recap - Hayes was used along with Healy to provide some experience (and take the blame for the scrum being poor) when he started out first. Buckely & Healy were tried together. It didn't work. Buckley was dropped and Ross was brought in (who could now last 80 mins of a game).



Has Deccy Fitz ever strung more than 3 games together at Rabo level?



Of course it has everything to do with it. O'Gara's form was good enough up to the end of Jan this year to get short-listed for Players Player of the Year. Then he heads of for a stretch on the bench in the 6ns and plays about 40 mins of rugby over a period of 8 weeks and doesn't take a placekick. He then comes back to Munster and acquires a dead lead from a tackle by Darren Cave in the HC semi-final and is out for a couple of weeks and makes the bench for the Ospreys semi-final when low and behold he has to go on early in the match when its plainly obvious he isn't fully fit.

Sexton wasn't selected for the game against Wales because he couldn't kick snow off a rope and no doubt Gatland was aware of it. Wales would have had a field day infringing knowing that. O'Gara didn't lose that match. Wales won it with superb defence. All they did was tackle all day. They did exactly what Ireland did to Australia.

So they did what a lot of good teams do against O'Gara - they shut off the outside backs and forced him to carry the ball which led to multiple turnovers and no attacking threat and also O'Gara kicked dead a number of times and was a weak link in defence so what exactly did he do that was better than Sexton would have done???

[NotreDameRFC]

Good points there alright.

I think I might be slightly biased though mainly because I'm Irish born and reared. My wife is American and our daughter, while born in Ireland, is a citizen of both. We'll end up moving state side in a few years and I'll always be conscious of our daughter's Irishness (plus any future kids we may have).

If she has kids in the future would they be any less Irish just because they're not born in Ireland?

There's no right answers I suppose.

Sorry to go off topic.

similar situation for me...im stateside nearly 20 yrs...Yankee wife...3 kids born in the USA...and are proud of their irishness ...though Americans tend to embrace their ancestry more than lets say aussie or kiwi equivalents imo.

We better open an Irish American thread( and move off this thread) before chippy takes away our Aran jumpers

[jeepers]

So they did what a lot of good teams do against O'Gara - they shut off the outside backs and forced him to carry the ball which led to multiple turnovers and no attacking threat and also O'Gara kicked dead a number of times and was a weak link in defence so what exactly did he do that was better than Sexton would have done???

I didn't see much attacking threat from Sexton in his 25 minutes (with Reddan) on the pitch. At least Ireland put some points on the board when he was on. Ireland conceeded a try with Sexton on the pitch, so his superior defence added nothing either.

I didn't see much improvement in the performance against Wales in the 6Ns this year. Sexton had 75 minutes and in that time, Ireland conceeded 3 tries.

ya, ya, I know its the coach's fault.

[jeepers]

similar situation for me...im stateside nearly 20 yrs...Yankee wife...3 kids born in the USA...and are proud of their irishness ...though Americans tend to embrace their ancestry more than lets say aussie or kiwi equivalents imo.

We better open an Irish American thread( and move off this thread) before chippy takes away our Aran jumpers

I don't know about that. Stephen Moore was tweeting about watching the All Ireland Football Final recently.

[redherring]

Ah lads can we give the ROG - Sexton debate a rest. Ireland lost to Wales twice last season because Wales played better rugby! They were better in both the WC and 6N. Bantering on about how many points Ireland conceded when ROG was on the field and then Sexton is really clutching at straws on the debate end of things. The two of them are fine OH's but in totally different ways.

[NotreDameRFC]

I don't know about that. Stephen Moore was tweeting about watching the All Ireland Football Final recently.

Though Moore has 2 Irish parents i recall...and was born in Saudi???


Moreso in general i think jeepers that Americans embrace it.

[the plastic paddy]

Ah lads can we give the ROG - Sexton debate a rest. Ireland lost to Wales twice last season because Wales played better rugby! They were better in both the WC and 6N. Bantering on about how many points Ireland conceded when ROG was on the field and then Sexton is really clutching at straws on the debate end of things. The two of them are fine OH's but in totally different ways.

Thanks redherring, the only thing we can probably be confident about though is that ROG is unlikely to still be playing come the next RWC so we have got to start bringing in a young backup/ challenger to Sexton sooner rather than later.

[redherring]

Thanks redherring, the only thing we can probably be confident about though is that ROG is unlikely to still be playing come the next RWC so we have got to start bringing in a young backup/ challenger to Sexton sooner rather than later.

Definitely. The sooner Jackson, Keatley and Madigan get their chance the better. Madigan might end up a utility player due to his current role with Leinster. I'd love to see ROG hang on and pass on some of his kicking and tactical experience to the younger lads.

[jeepers]

Though Moore has 2 Irish parents i recall...and was born in Saudi???


Moreso in general i think jeepers that Americans embrace it.

He has and was. But considering his sport is rugby and was brought up so far away from Ireland, choosing to represent Australia, I thought it was surprising that he would be interested in watching a GAA game which he wouldn't have seen much of. If he is following GAA now, there is every chance his kids will continue to do so.

[the plastic paddy]

Definitely. The sooner Jackson, Keatley and Madigan get their chance the better. Madigan might end up a utility player due to his current role with Leinster. I'd love to see ROG hang on and pass on some of his kicking and tactical experience to the younger lads.

I still think there is a need for a proper kicking coach within Irish rugby, someone who can work with all the players in the island. You see some poor enough technique out of hand and off the tee; ROG's brilliance as a kicker meant there was has been no need for such a position over the last dozen years but I think Madigan, Keatley and JJ would benefit greatly from an expert.

[Aussiedub]

I didn't see much attacking threat from Sexton in his 25 minutes (with Reddan) on the pitch. At least Ireland put some points on the board when he was on. Ireland conceeded a try with Sexton on the pitch, so his superior defence added nothing either.

I didn't see much improvement in the performance against Wales in the 6Ns this year. Sexton had 75 minutes and in that time, Ireland conceeded 3 tries.

ya, ya, I know its the coach's fault.

except Ireland were beating Wales when DK took Sexton off during the 6Nations...

[hellovating]

It's Niall Ronan and Shane Jennings. We were so badly stuck for flankers in that game that Rhys Ruddock came off the bench after being flown out from the JWC.

yep, good shout with ronan. jesus, ronan and jennings... we really were fecked.

[hellovating]

He has and was. But considering his sport is rugby and was brought up so far away from Ireland, choosing to represent Australia, I thought it was surprising that he would be interested in watching a GAA game which he wouldn't have seen much of. If he is following GAA now, there is every chance his kids will continue to do so.

Moore lived in Galway until he was 5 or 6, i believe.

[artaneboy]

I don't think Heaslip is a poor player but to say he is better than the hairy donkey is a bit foolish IMHO; just as a matter of interest, what do you see as the hairy donkey's flaws apart from his old fella being a bit over keen to join in?http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sypud2O8E00

Ah I did all this about eight months ago. All the arguments are in the archive. There's nothing I could say that will persuade some here. I'll just make the very general point that your man has invariably played, for both France and Biarittz, at the back of a dominant scrum and pack; Heaslip has rarely, even on Ireland's best days had that platform. We might gave punched our weight but we very seldom monstered teams. And even Leinster's strength is not especially focused there. More a general focus on winning the breakdown, strong individual ball-carriers supported with multiple options and good passing to the wider channels. He still excells at all aspects needed for that style. Admittedly since the emergence of O'Brien he's been less prominent as a ball carrier, but his ground-hog work is unmatched as an 8. And if your looking at players who go missing- your Hairy Baby is the man to finger before the pathetic slanders of Heaslip need even be considered. That is all!

[overthehillprop]

Sean Cronin, Michael Bent, Paul Marshal, Deccie Fitz, TOH and Craig Gilroy called up to the Irish squad.

[Cowboy]

Michael Bent called up to the Irish squad.

700 pages

[Thomond78]

Hmmm. Bit of a mixed bag, there, but suits us fine.

[Cowboy]

Hmmm. Bit of a mixed bag, there, but suits us fine.

Whisht!! Say nathin and wait for December with fingers and toes crossed

[The Outlaw]

Ah I did all this about eight months ago. All the arguments are in the archive. There's nothing I could say that will persuade some here. I'll just make the very general point that your man has invariably played, for both France and Biarittz, at the back of a dominant scrum and pack; Heaslip has rarely, even on Ireland's best days had that platform. We might gave punched our weight but we very seldom monstered teams. And even Leinster's strength is not especially focused there. More a general focus on winning the breakdown, strong individual ball-carriers supported with multiple options and good passing to the wider channels. He still excells at all aspects needed for that style. Admittedly since the emergence of O'Brien he's been less prominent as a ball carrier, but his ground-hog work is unmatched as an 8. And if your looking at players who go missing- your Hairy Baby is the man to finger before the pathetic slanders of Heaslip need even be considered. That is all!

Parisse plays with the worst team in the 6 Nations and still looks every inch world class.

I think Heaslip could have been world class. Certainly has all the tools. But he has too many outside interests to be a top class player IMO.

A move to France could well have been the making of him.

[Thomond78]

Whisht!! Say nathin and wait for December with fingers and toes crossed

[Thomond78]

Parisse plays with the worst team in the 6 Nations and still looks every inch world class.

I think Heaslip could have been world class. Certainly has all the tools. But he has too many outside interests to be a top class player IMO.

A move to France could well have been the making of him.

Good sweet unicycling baby Jeebus. Someone could watch the RWC final and claim Hairydonkey goes missing?

[munstershane]

Sean Cronin, Michael Bent, Paul Marshal, Deccie Fitz, TOH and Craig Gilroy called up to the Irish squad.

Link? Can't find anything on RTE or IRFU site

[Tobyglen]

On twitter MS

Michael Corcoran tweeted it.

[joeriddick]

Sean Cronin, Michael Bent, Paul Marshal, Deccie Fitz, TOH and Craig Gilroy called up to the Irish squad.

Delighted with this. Felix can get back up to speed without a bunch of 17 stone South African's barreling down his throat (oooh missus).

Paul Marshall deserves a shot, as does Gilroy. Michael Bent's first game in Ireland might be in Test for Ireland.

[munstershane]

I think Paddy Jackson was included as well.

[taz]

Sean Cronin, Michael Bent, Paul Marshal, Deccie Fitz, TOH and Craig Gilroy called up to the Irish squad.

Fair play to Craig Gilroy.