Earls 13?

[Mcork]

Personally, my biggest concern for Keith would be that he never shakes off that 'utility player' tag - It's both a blessing and a curse, but I think with the natural talent that Keith has, then it would be better to nail is flag to the mast and develop his skills in one slot - Whether that will be centre or not, time will tell. I always feel like it's better to be a master of one than "handy" at many.

When reading topics like this, it always reminds me of Adam Ashley-Cooper down here in Oz, a hugely talented player who has been around the scene a while now but never seems to be able to get it together at Club level. A great player no doubt, but I wonder how good he would/could be if he was stuck to one position.

That is very true. Luke Fitz another example IMO. Let's not even discuss poor Fergus Mcfadden.

[garryowen2323]

Good god I've read some rubbish in my time but the centre issues have to be up there!

What I've learnt over the last few months...........

1) McFadden should be starting for Ireland at 12 yet can't get on for his province
2) Cave should be our new 13 because he's been the form 13 at club level yet Wallace shouldn't be near the squad regardless of being the form 12 at club level
3) BOD should be playing at 12, 13 and even 7
4) We should keep the Darce/BOD partnership going yet need to find a better 12 than Darce so will move BOD to 12 instead
5) Earls isn't related to an international 13 yet should be playing there with BOD at 12 (see above re: partnership break up)
6) Luke Fitz is still Ireland's best centre past Darce/BOD
7) Tommy Bowe should also be playing 12 or 13 or somewhere
8) Mafi runs back into traffic and is bad for Earls at 13 yet Darcy runs back into traffic and is good for Earls at 13

For what it's worth my opinion on the whole thing is that Earls is clearly our next best 13 after BOD. Darce/BOD will start the 6 Nations at centre with it being BOD's swansong. Then Earls will move in full time after that. He doesn't have the defensive organisational skills that BOD has and never will. Doesn't have the pilfering abilities of BOD and never will. However he currently runs lines that BOD can't and at pace that BOD can't. Neither of them are particularly good passers of the ball. Think Earls kicking is better and his tackling is currently better too (I've never seen BOD fall off so many tackles than in the last 18 months since he hurt his shoulder)

[Cowboy]

Good god I've read some rubbish in my time but the centre issues have to be up there!

What I've learnt over the last few months...........

1) McFadden should be starting for Ireland at 12 yet can't get on for his province
2) Cave should be our new 13 because he's been the form 13 at club level yet Wallace shouldn't be near the squad regardless of being the form 12 at club level
3) BOD should be playing at 12, 13 and even 7
4) We should keep the Darce/BOD partnership going yet need to find a better 12 than Darce so will move BOD to 12 instead
5) Earls isn't related to an international 13 yet should be playing there with BOD at 12 (see above re: partnership break up)
6) Luke Fitz is still Ireland's best centre past Darce/BOD
7) Tommy Bowe should also be playing 12 or 13 or somewhere
8) Mafi runs back into traffic and is bad for Earls at 13 yet Darcy runs back into traffic and is good for Earls at 13

For what it's worth my opinion on the whole thing is that Earls is clearly our next best 13 after BOD. Darce/BOD will start the 6 Nations at centre with it being BOD's swansong. Then Earls will move in full time after that. He doesn't have the defensive organisational skills that BOD has and never will. Doesn't have the pilfering abilities of BOD and never will. However he currently runs lines that BOD can't and at pace that BOD can't. Neither of them are particularly good passers of the ball. Think Earls kicking is better and his tackling is currently better too (I've never seen BOD fall off so many tackles than in the last 18 months since he hurt his shoulder)

Stop making sense! This thread has no place for reasoned opinions or suggestions based on evidence!!

Cronin 12 Rory Best 13. Cronin has the power and pace to punch holes and the hands to release Rory. And we all know Rory has the best distribution on the Irish team.

[B.A.]

Good god I've read some rubbish in my time but the centre issues have to be up there!

What I've learnt over the last few months...........

1) McFadden should be starting for Ireland at 12 yet can't get on for his province
2) Cave should be our new 13 because he's been the form 13 at club level yet Wallace shouldn't be near the squad regardless of being the form 12 at club level
3) BOD should be playing at 12, 13 and even 7
4) We should keep the Darce/BOD partnership going yet need to find a better 12 than Darce so will move BOD to 12 instead
5) Earls isn't related to an international 13 yet should be playing there with BOD at 12 (see above re: partnership break up)
6) Luke Fitz is still Ireland's best centre past Darce/BOD
7) Tommy Bowe should also be playing 12 or 13 or somewhere
8) Mafi runs back into traffic and is bad for Earls at 13 yet Darcy runs back into traffic and is good for Earls at 13

For what it's worth my opinion on the whole thing is that Earls is clearly our next best 13 after BOD. Darce/BOD will start the 6 Nations at centre with it being BOD's swansong. Then Earls will move in full time after that. He doesn't have the defensive organisational skills that BOD has and never will. Doesn't have the pilfering abilities of BOD and never will. However he currently runs lines that BOD can't and at pace that BOD can't. Neither of them are particularly good passers of the ball. Think Earls kicking is better and his tackling is currently better too (I've never seen BOD fall off so many tackles than in the last 18 months since he hurt his shoulder)

I overheard kerry selector Ger O'Keeffe recently saying that if they took heed of everything the fans suggested they'd never pass the first round of the munster championship.

[Munsterboy]

Oh FFS lads, this is a fans forum and as such it's a place where we all get to play fantasy manager. Nobody here expects the coaching staff to take heed of us but that doesn't mean people shouldn't be free to post and debate their views, regardless of how ridiculous or left-field they may be.

Here's mine:
I hope that McFadden and Earls start to play more and more at 12 and 13 respectively for their provinces and prove good enough to nail down those positions in the near future. If they can't, they probably shouldn't be in the mix for Ireland.

I hope that DK starts to give them and/or the likes of Cave, Spence, O'Malley etc. some game time in the AIs to test and develop their ability at international level.

Come the 6Ns, I would still start D'Arcy and BOD if they are the best partnership at provincial level. I think D'Arcy gets a lot more stick than he deserves.

Paddy Wallace has been given umpteen chances at international level and hasn't got what it takes. Given his age, he's not going to get any better or stronger. He should not be in the picture.

No point in moving BOD at this stage. He's still a class act at 13. Let him play there until he is surpassed by a younger man or chooses to retire.

If Fitz comes back, starts playing centre for Leinster and proves to be the best option for Ireland, great. Until he does, he's a winger.

If Bowe starts playing centre for Ulster and proves to be the best option for Ireland, great. Until he does, he too is a winger.

[Mcork]

Munsterboy - good post. What about Downey though? It'll be very interesting to see whether himself and Earls can form an understanding. The argument for D'arcy/BOD always is they play better together but if one or both is playing poorly which has been the case more often than not these past seasons, then would dropping both not be an option especially if the munster pairing show real promise. Of course politically that would probably put the final nail in the coffin of DK. On the other hand, It would be a hell of a parting shot.
Of course, Kidney ruled Downey out of the NZ tour on the basis he was too old which might have been seen as a valid reason until he plucked the poor old paddy Wallace from a beach in the algarve to be minced by SBW.

[Munsterboy]

Munsterboy - good post. What about Downey though? It'll be very interesting to see whether himself and Earls can form an understanding. The argument for D'arcy/BOD always is they play better together but if one or both is playing poorly which has been the case more often than not these past seasons, then would dropping both not be an option especially if the munster pairing show real promise. Of course politically that would probably put the final nail in the coffin of DK. On the other hand, It would be a hell of a parting shot.
Of course, Kidney ruled Downey out of the NZ tour on the basis he was too old which might have been seen as a valid reason until he plucked the poor old paddy Wallace from a beach in the algarve to be minced by SBW.

Well, if Downey and Earls are the form partnership, I'd definitely consider them to start the 6Ns. However, I'd still like to see us giving a younger lad like McFadden some time at 12 in the AIs because Downey is not a long term option.

[Sketchy]

Well, if Downey and Earls are the form partnership, I'd definitely consider them to start the 6Ns. However, I'd still like to see us giving a younger lad like McFadden some time at 12 in the AIs because Downey is not a long term option.

Ya, hopefully McFadden can nudge his way in at 12 at Leinster. I don't see him as an international class winger, especially with the younger talent that will be chomping at his heels. He has all the attributes for a decent 12. Very direct runner too.

Who do people see as back up 12 to Downey should everything not go to plan? Plenty of lads there that could put there hands up but no clear front runner all the same if it was a Heineken Cup game:

Dineen,
Casey,
JJ,
Deasy,
Keatley,
Smith,
Barnes,

[Munsterboy]

Ya, hopefully McFadden can nudge his way in at 12 at Leinster. I don't see him as an international class winger, especially with the younger talent that will be chomping at his heels. He has all the attributes for a decent 12. Very direct runner too.

Who do people see as back up 12 to Downey should everything not go to plan? Plenty of lads there that could put there hands up but no clear front runner all the same if it was a Heineken Cup game:

Dineen,
Casey,
JJ,
Deasy,
Keatley,
Smith,
Barnes,

Dineen has the size and I like the cut of his jib. JJ could but we probably want him as a 10 longer term. Keatley played a bit at 13 for Connacht but don't think he ever played 12. Worth a look though. He's a solid tackler and it could be the making of him.

Dunno about the rest. Deasy's too small. I've only seen Barnes and Casey play 13.

[Sketchy]

Dineen has the size and I like the cut of his jib. JJ could but we probably want him as a 10 longer term. Keatley played a bit at 13 for Connacht but don't think he ever played 12. Worth a look though. He's a solid tackler and it could be the making of him.

Dunno about the rest. Deasy's too small. I've only seen Barnes and Casey play 13.

Ya, a big season from Dineen would be great. He made some nice yardage towards the end of last year.

Casey played 12 with the Baabaas but I didn't catch the game. Apparently he was decent enough but I can't confirm.

Then Keatley, he is a blocky chap for a 10. Possibly to his downfall when it comes to his kicking. Remember years ago when ROG tried to bulk up, his kicking was awful. He lost the weight/muscle and it came back. I know some of Keatley's brother's mates from Dublin and they said Leinster tried to make a 12 of him and he refused to play there. Pity, cos he is a decent tackler, can pass, and has a bit of gas when he goes for a break too. He could pick up some badly needed Heineken Cup experience there if ROG holds on to the 10 shirt. He probably came to Munster a year too early in hindsight. He certainly could have done with the exposure the Connacht lads got last year.

[Red Hand Hero]

Interesting that Outlaw also he was class at centre at u20 level.. I seem to recall Keith playing on the wing for quite a bit with Thomond in AIL Div 2 around the same time. I could be wrong , but I am pretty sure he did anyway.

Now I could be wrong here but if my memory serves me correctly then Cave played 13 for the Irish U-20's?

[mtcmolloy]

His best international performance by some way was at FB.

also for the lions.

Dineen has the size and I like the cut of his jib. JJ could but we probably want him as a 10 longer term. Keatley played a bit at 13 for Connacht but don't think he ever played 12. Worth a look though. He's a solid tackler and it could be the making of him.

Dunno about the rest. Deasy's too small. I've only seen Barnes and Casey play 13.

I think deasy is quality. a latter day dutchy holland if you will. And I find the name "scott" quite cool. I used to like dineen, but have decided that he looks odd when he's running.

[LondonMunster]

I prefer seeing Earls on the wing. He is a quality finisher. Of course he is up against Zebo, Howlett, O'Dea, Johne Murphy and Denis Hurley for a spot on the flanks. Would Earls be a better option on the wing ahead of Zebo and Howlett?

This is very difficult. I wonder what Oscar and Rob Penney think?

[Big Game]

Competition is a good thing and Earls will have to step up another level to keep his position. Most teams are playing physically huge centre's, so he may be better off on the wing. But if we can get a solid number 12 who can deliver good ball to Earls at 13, I think his gink/side step could be the key to unlock defenses and get us attacking. A Tipoki or Halstead type 12 with Earls at 13 could be the combo..