For me, I think its silly to place much stock in this tour given the circumstances around it. He should be judged on his world cup and six nations performances. Which have been pretty poor, but if we didn't sack him in April why do it now? He'll have one more six nations to turn things around in my view.
I agree - hold the ship steady until he is judged on six nations
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I thought he was judged on the WC? Or last years 6N? Or the 6N before that...
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I don't see why he needs any further time. He has been in the job for 4 years now. He is either good enough or he is not.
I don't see the point in giving him another 6 Nations if it is decided that he isn't up to it.
I think the best possible thing for Irish rugby would be hiring a competent head coach, someone who will watch the players perform for their provinces throughout the season and then select them on the back of their form. He has the Irish team back in the 90's at this stage (clueless muck interspersed with the odd hell for leather game), it's painful to watch and I've only had a feeling of resignation watching Ireland play for the last three years. Players regress when they come under his coaching and he's a very poor selector, refusing to pick players on form when it's immediately obvious to the dog in the street that their form merits selection. He has the media in his pocket though so won't come under any pressure on that front, it's up to the IRFU to do the right thing but I doubt they will.
You are right. They should have sacked him in April.Originally Posted by Dowlinz
2011
He needs a serious look at his backroom staff if he's to stay on, imo.
It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into.
Every plan I have is the best plan in the room. Everybody get quiet and listen to it, and everybody will win
On Sky Sports it was the first time I heard them discuss the possibility of including Schmidt in the coaching setup, even as a consultant. I thought one of Schmidt's kids was heading back to NZ next year to continue their education. Will he stick around in Ireland?
We shouldn't be waiting around until next year to find out, offer Schmidt a large salary and the ability to pick his own backroom staff. He's the best coach currently operating in the NH imo and it'd be criminal to let the Irish team rot even further under Kidney while risking Schmidt leaving the country. The IRFU should be doing everything in their power to promote him to top job but most likely won't.
It's time for him to go he has a worse record than EOS ffs
Its a tough one. The players need to take a lot of responsibility IMO. He cant do it for them! But, if hes not able to get the best out of them anymore then maybe it is time? I dont know though because if he was a bad coach would we of beat Australia? Won the Grand Slam? Went unbeaten for how many games? I think we are just not good enough anymore and the players are just not there or at the standard required to compete with the best. We have a good (not fantastic) first 15, after that we are struggling and relying on blood and badges as opposed to talent and skill set whereas NZ SA and Australia to a lesser extent can field 2 if not 3 teams capable of beating our first 15 IMO. I really do think no matter who we had at the helm on this tour the outcome would be the same. Sad day for Irish rugby and id imagine there is no-one hurting more than the lads that are in the dressing room. Its always darker before the dawn!!
Hopefully with 3 Kiwi coaches in the provinces next year they will all insist on the basics being performed so well that we are in a better shape next year....
I'd throw whatever money is then required at someone like Nick Mallet/Jake White/Wayne Smith/Graham Henry involved.
We shouldn't be waiting around until next year to find out, offer Schmidt a large salary and the ability to pick his own backroom staff. He's the best coach currently operating in the NH imo and it'd be criminal to let the Irish team rot even further under Kidney while risking Schmidt leaving the country. The IRFU should be doing everything in their power to promote him to top job but most likely won't.
Schmidt doesn't want to coach Ireland, he will never coach Ireland. He is a very good coach but would never work for the IRFU as our head coach. He will leave Ireland after he is finished with his current position.
Well that's that so, no point in even trying to entice the best coach in the NH, someone on the internet said he doesn't want to coach Ireland.
I don't stand anywhere on Kidney's future. I can neither hire or fire him.
He needs to go but he won't will he
He'll get the 6N to prove that he's transitioned the team. The "he doesn't change" thing is ****e, and most of the complaints about him overlooking players translate as "he overlooked the guy from my province in a marginal call".
He's changed the team a lot over the last three years, and will have the 6N to prove it can deliver. If he doesn't, he should go.
"We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow
"Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy
Nonsense but that is the argument that is regularly trotted out. Here is another argument- we are at risk of dipping below 30% success rate against top opposition in the last two years. Kidney is a spoofer
and how many of the changes were due to injury/retirement though??
"Nonsense" doesn't count as a rebuttal. Are you saying that the change in players since the grand slam (whole front row, new lock, new open side, new half backs, new wing, total change on bench) hasn't happened?
"We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow
"Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy
Kidneys record post-2009: 14 wins 1 draw 21 defeats (38% win rate)
Kidneys record post-2009 against Top 6 sides: 4 wins 1 draw 16 losses (19% win rate)
The point is that he has to replace them - has to rebuild with what's available.
The "but he doesn't drop enough players" argument is incoherent horse ****.
"We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven into an age of unreason if we dig deep into our history and remember we are not descended from fearful men" Edward R Murrow
"Little by little, we have been brought into the present condition in which we are able neither to tolerate the evils from which we suffer, nor the remedies we need to cure them." - Livy
Horan, Flannery, Hayes, Wallace, Leamy all gone through injury/retirement, Stringer gone from Munster. Hardly changes by choice....
See the above figures (I have worked it out as being slightly more generous to Declan- 42% win rate, 30% against top opposition and I include Scotland in that) and he has not been developing the right players at the right time- he is a reactionary and is ruining us. This period will long be remembered as being total pox with journalists completely embedded and useless.
Wheres Horan gone?
To be honest I couldn't give a flying rats posterior if we trounce everyone in the next 6N and win the most convincing GS of all time. He's got to go. This success rate wouldn't be good enough at junior level and it's not good enough at international level with a team full of players like this.
To be fair I don't blame Kidney so as much as I blame the IRFU for extending his contract before the RWC
It is the job of the coach to motivate players and to pick the best possible payers at his disposal...has Kidney done this in the past while? Apart from the odd performance here and there has he motivated the players? In my opinion, no. Has he always picked the best players available to him? I think the answer to that one is fairly obvious.
There's more than just Kidney at fault, albeit, he is at fault. The RWC preseason started a year ago last week, 53 weeks is too long a season, even with break etc. The bodies are breaking down and say what you like, you can't play every game like we played last week. The tour to NZ was a bad idea from the off.
That being said, the senior players need to look themselves. It's not Kidney's fault Best can't throw the ball after 50+ caps, it's Kidney's fault he's still allowed start. O'Gara is no longer a better option than Madigan, especially when we've other kickers like McFadden and Sexton on the pitch too.
It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into.
Every plan I have is the best plan in the room. Everybody get quiet and listen to it, and everybody will win
Has he....lost the dressing room! oh that old nugget
Con Artist
It is true though- the dogs in the street know it
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