Hartley cited for biting

[Stanley]

http://www.rugbynetwork.net/boards/r...tm?98,13139954



Re: Biting Ferris' finger
Posted by: Which Tyler (IP Logged)
Date: 18 March, 2012 09:33

I spent about an hour this morning going over and over the iPlayer footage; I'll just repost what I've put elsewhere if you don't mind.

[www.espnscrum.com]

It was a ruck 27.22 on BBC's match clock. Ferris is on his back, and you can see him flinch; O'Callaghan gets a little aggro as it breaks up.
I'm pretty sure it's Hartley, Corbs & Parling in that ruck, Barritt guarding the open side, but is well out of it.
I can't see an actual bite, too many bodies in the way, but Owens seemed convinced given marks on Ferris' finger; so I accept that a bite happened. You can identify who those bodies are, but not enough to say who did the act, from the iPlayer replay.

If they can find out who dunnit (and it looks to me that O'Callaghan had the best view), then a really hefty ban is well deserved; this does NOT look to be a replay of DannyG trying to remove Kevin (he's a devout christian you know) Mealamu's finger from his mouth.

I am sincerely ashamed to be supporting a team that would do this, and even if the videos can't show conclusively who dunnit, and players themselves really ought to know, and should hang him out to dry. No excuses IMO.



ETA:
I've just been back to the iPlayer, moving time on 27.48 (match clock), after reporting to Owens, O'Callaghan goes straight up to Hartley and starts off on him, which starts the words, and nearly handbags that first drew our attention to it all.

I draw no libelous conclusions from this, and make absolutely no accusations on any individual player. Owens examines the wound at the time, and sees enough evidence to accept that a bite happened, so I'm happy (well, not happy, but you know what I mean) to accept that a bite did indeed occur.

Have to say, Owens handled it exceptionally well, was very close to becoming an all-in free-for-all with both packs facing off.

[Stanley]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rug...en-Ferris.html



There you go, Hartley firmly in the frame, lets see how Lancaster reacts now, the boot should go in.

[RichardP]

Hartley is to face the charge of “acts contrary to good sportsmanship” under IRB law 10.4m and faces a minimum ban of 12 weeks if found guilty by at independent Six Nations disciplinary panel. No date has been set for the hearing.

Alberto Recaldini (Italy), the independent match commissioner, had 48 hours from the final whistle to bring a citing from the final whistle of England's 30-9 victory at Twickenham on Saturday.

[Boo-boo]

Silly boy! he bit the very hand that fed them...the pre match dressing room fodder!

[slipper1]

NH captain Hartley accused of biting Ferris on Saturday, their stand in captain Clark accused of intentionally breaking an opponent's arm on Sunday. Impressive !!

[Groundhog]

Hope he gets a year, always been a dirty player

[NiallGK]

It should be interesting to hear what the panel have to say about this on Against the Head. It's starting in 10 minutes time over on RTÉ 2.

[taz]

It should be interesting to hear what the panel have to say about this on Against the Head. It's starting in 10 minutes time over on RTÉ 2.

Well one of them wants him to start for the Lions.I will now refer to that gent as Hugh Farrelly mark 2 from now on.

[SD13]

Well one of them wants him to start for the Lions.I will now refer to that gent as Hugh Farrelly mark 2 from now on.

Out of curiosity which one is HFMK2?
Given that Hartley has already done 6 months for gouging, if he's found guilty will they throw the book at him. Can't argue previous good behaviour.

[taz]

Out of curiosity which one is HFMK2?
Given that Hartley has already done 6 months for gouging, if he's found guilty will they throw the book at him. Can't argue previous good behaviour.

Frankie Sheehan who made that pick,even though lenihan did not agree.

[Old Dog]

Well one of them wants him to start for the Lions.

Seems like a good pick to me. Lions are carnivorous and use their teeth (to bite) and claws (to gouge) their prey to death - the similarity with Hartley is uncanny. I hope that Ferris has had an anti-tetanus jab.

And thus endeth a great weekend for Mallinder and the Saints (or does it - is Callum Clark for the high jump too?) - it couldn't have happened to a nicer bunch of thugs.

[MunsterLux]

We all know how this works. He'll go in, plead guilty, behave like an angel at the hearing and get 8 weeks and be back in time for the tour to Oz.

[Old Dog]

We all know how this works. He'll go in, plead guilty, behave like an angel at the hearing and get 8 weeks and be back in time for the tour to Oz.

Nope. This won't be an English disciplinary committee - it'll be a 6Ns Committee, probably including Scotland's Douglas Hunter and a Frenchman who hates Les Rosbiefs and they will throw the book at the Kiwi mercenary.

[MunsterLux]

Nope. This won't be an English disciplinary committee - it'll be a 6Ns Committee, probably including Scotland's Douglas Hunter and a Frenchman who hates Les Rosbiefs and they will throw the book at the Kiwi mercenary.

Hopefully.

[The Word Is Born]

Unless he retains Lasissi & Partners for his citing hearing I'd expect Hartley won't be laving up his boots for 12 months.

[Cowboy]

Hasnt he form with this stuff? Am I correct in recollecting someone else else ended up with their fingers inside his mouth? Cant remember who it was though

[bakkushan]

Hasnt he form with this stuff? Am I correct in recollecting someone else else ended up with their fingers inside his mouth? Cant remember who it was though

I think it was in last year's HC final, clearly visible but not cited.

[Boo-boo]

[Ragusa]

Very hard to prove biting of a finger with no Blood but maybe teeth marks. The Lawyers will have a field day and nothing proved. Players wear gum shields so even more difficult to prove biting on a finger. You need to have a bit of an ear or nose off to get a verdict here.

[Drick]

Very hard to prove biting of a finger with no Blood but maybe teeth marks. The Lawyers will have a field day and nothing proved. Players wear gum shields so even more difficult to prove biting on a finger. You need to have a bit of an ear or nose off to get a verdict here.

In this case, Nigel Owens did say to the captains that he saw a bite mark on Ferris Finger, but he didn't see who commited the offence.

[McCloud]

The real culprit has being identified Hartley's off the hook

[No. 16]

We all know how this works. He'll go in, plead guilty, behave like an angel at the hearing and get 8 weeks and be back in time for the tour to Oz.

With reduction by 4 weeks from minimum for previous record and conduct at the hearing?
10.4(m) Biting
LE – 12 weeks
MR – 18 weeks
TE – 24+ weeks
Max. Sanction - 208 weeks
That is to say that there is enough evidence and a case made. It'll either be thrown out or a lot longer. Would Nigel be subpoenaed?

[bakkushan]

I think it was in last year's HC final, clearly visible but not cited.

This is the one. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utd6mda7BhY

And this is just ironic. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=JXu0GEiDUYc

[John Cooper Clarke]

For a citing to have taken place there has to be some specific evidence.

The tv coverage showed irate Irish players, and the ref saying he could see the bite mark, but hadn't seen the incident and therefore couldn't identify the alleged culprit.

[McCloud]

For a citing to have taken place there has to be some specific evidence.

The tv coverage showed irate Irish players, and the ref saying he could see the bite mark, but hadn't seen the incident and therefore couldn't identify the alleged culprit.

Must be some evidence as the citing commissioner has cited him?

[taz]

Must be some evidence as the citing commissioner has cited him?

Like the "evidence" the citing comissioner provided against Ferris in the Welsh match?

[GesPM]

This is the one. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utd6mda7BhY

And this is just ironic. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=JXu0GEiDUYc

The Dowson bit after is just as bad, that's a straight red shoulder charge at the face when you see it in real time, not replay.

I think the citing is off the back of Owens saying he will report it, and presumably did put it in his match report, therefore it has to be investigated. The Ferris one, as I believe someone like Old Dog pointed out, worked out in our benefit as it allowed them to effectively say Barnes got it entirely wrong. Had Ferris committed a tip tackle he'd have got some ban, even if it was reduced to nothing for various bits and pieces. That he got a no case to answer was as clear a message as they could send it wasn't even a penalty. So I wouldn't go complaining about that bit.

[the_dazz]

The more I see **** like that from Saints Scum the happier I get when I think about the drumming Munster gave them and Zebos 3 tries.

Hartley should get the book thrown at him, for the sake of rugby.

[syriana]

Unless there's more evidence than video images publicly available, I don't see how the disciplinary committee can find him guilty.

Hartley is no angel by any means, but the onus is still on the 'prosecution' to prove their case - and should thye prove it then he deserves the ban he'll receive. I have to wonder though, what were Ferris's fingers doing in Hartley's mouth in the first place?

[Old Dog]

I have to wonder though, what were Ferris's fingers doing in Hartley's mouth in the first place?

As did I! However, in the opinion of another MF poster, by asking that question we are making an assumption that may or may not be true.